Wanqueur du Jour!
by Jen See on Jul 11, 2008 2:51 PM EDT
in News
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PrintSpanish rider, Manuel Beltran of Team Liquigas has tested positive for EPO. The A sample from a test conducted on 5 July after the first stage of the Tour de France contained traces of EPO, according to l' Agence Française de lutte contre le dopage, the AFLD. The 37 year old, who has been professional since 1995, was among those targetted for additional testing after screening tests carried out on 3-4 July prior to the Tour.
In the early evening Friday, French police descended on the Team Liquigas hotel. It is unclear whether the police found anything in the hotel, but Manuel Beltran was taken for questioning by the gendarmes, who represent a special anti-doping unit. Beltran will not take the start for tomorrow's stage.
Preliminary reports suggested that the team would fire the Spanish rider immediately, but Team Liquigas has now said that they will await the analysis of the B-sample before deciding the future of the rider. For now, the team has suspended Beltran fro competition. Liquigas also confirmed that they will continue to ride the Tour de France, as the contract the teams signed with the ASO does not require that they withdraw.
Manuel Beltan began his career at Mapei, and subsequently rode for Banesto, Ullrich's Team Coast, and Armstrong's Postal/Discovery. He has predominantly ridden as gregario and counts only a few victories in the shorter Spanish stage races among his results.
Source, Original Story, 10.12 am, PST: l'equipe.fr, Damien Ressiot.
Update, 07.12.2009, 8.34 am, PST: Today's press reports that French authorities have released Manuel Beltran from custody, after questioning him for two hours. The search of his hotel room also found nothing incriminating. A preliminary inquiry has been opened on the case by judicial authorities.
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if nothing else
chapeau to the vampires for the quick turnaround. Lets just hope that accuracy wasn’t sacrificed to get this out before the race hits the mountains.
Crap, crap, crap!
Just when i thought we would have a sportfocused Tour.
LIQ , why am I not surprised?
Any clean LA lieutenants left?
Chechu, Azevedo, Hincapie
The only ones of the key mountain men who haven’t tested positive
(if this indeed is confirmed as you say)
fourth former lance lieutenant
to be nailed for doping. others were heras, hamilton and landis. another nail in the lance doped coffin? one has to wonder…
well...
did they learn from the master but not quite pass the “test?” maybe when signori dr. ferrari held a class on how not to get caught they were absent that day?
ok, a little harsh but i think it all adds fuel to the question about la and did he or didn’t he.
well, they must have been stupid
since only LA could bribe the UCI and the labs!!
enough of LA, sorry for bringing this never ending story up.
OP, anyone?
reportedly...
Riccardo Ricco was also tested four times in five days. They’re testing and testing lots.
This stinks,
hate to see it dominate the news when the race has been so intersting, and generally getting good press so far. Plus now tthe guys at VS are going to have to work overtime to find video of Beltran riding his bike backwards to update their ads.
by Katiek on Jul 11, 2008 1:39 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
WTF was he THINKING??!??!?
After a hard day of watching a Tour stage, I like to unwind with Verbotene Liebe
Perhaps the recent news that EPO was more difficult to detect
emboldened some riders. It was predictable.
Nah
If you’re 37 and doping now, it can’t possibly be a new thing.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
huh?
his doping stories have all been confirmed so far. not sure he’s unreliable. he just has great sources.
did he catch Lance?
as far as I know, he still has the 7 victories.
I have no idea if LA cheated or not, I don’t know what happened there, but the Thorpe story was really, really low.
So I’ll still wait until this is confirmed.
and even if he did - everyone else was
Go Team Zoe!
Cavendish, Di Gregorio, Fothen, Kirchen
, Kreuziger, Lowe, Siutsou
, Ten Dam
, Y.Trofimov and Vandevelde
Doh,
Guess VeloNews idea of a good health tour just went out the window.
People please, the temptation is just too great. Espially when you are used to the game.
But, maybe if they keep bustin fools, they will eventually give up?
Word to tha mutha, straight outta Aurillac
If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when are you going to have time to do it again?
Why would a gregario be loading up on this stuff anyway?
It’s not like the guy is making a huge salary, or is reported to be preparing for some new goal of being a GC contender.
He’s 37!
He is almost at the end of he career which should have been the end of this year, or maybe next year at the most before he would be far too past his prime.
That is the part which doesn’t make sense.
As I recall
He was the only other name, besides LA, linked with the back tested EPO samples from 99.
by australopithecine on Jul 11, 2008 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
according to velonews, one of several
The gregario-defense is useless
If anything it’s those guys who have been juicing the most to be able to handle the inhumane workload.
The same case of Moreni last year, end of career and then positive
now Liquigas is facing a 100.000€ fine, right?
by King of Doping on Jul 11, 2008 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
-1
I will be 37 this year.
Thanks for reminding me that I am getting too old to hang with the hipsters.
Guess i’ll turn to pop rocks.
If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when are you going to have time to do it again?
by CannonDowell on Jul 11, 2008 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
No problem man... I'm 34...
... we can sit on the porch and yell at all these whippersnappers to get off the lawn.
After a hard day of watching a Tour stage, I like to unwind with Verbotene Liebe
sheeeooot
Y’all wait till your a touch older… 30 old? bah that makes me ancient and I’m only 45, and still refuse to grow up!
Now who’s in my seat on the porch swing and where’s my dad-blasted lemonade you young punks….
by Christopher See on Jul 11, 2008 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh you big baby! (age 50)
You probably don’t even remember when the wheels were square! THAT was when the Tour had MEN racing it, not these whiners! lol
Heh heh
Let’s just say Dan, Sarah and CannonDowell should all get off my lawn… but I should get off R Mc’s and Fred’s. Just.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
It makes for an interesting mental picture...
... a terrace of crotchety 30 and 40something cycling fans all yelling at the guy on their left to get the hell off their lawn.
After a hard day of watching a Tour stage, I like to unwind with Verbotene Liebe
Where's Monty? Maybe he'll get this reference
“Get off my show, mate.”
60% of the time, it works every time.
I'm really late to this thread as I was pretty bummed
but, can I just say – you are all welcome to camp out on my lawn anytime. :-)
"The most wasted day is that in which we have not laughed."
Being older is a big reason to dope.
Your strength, stamina and testosterone are weakening. For a pro athelete getting older must be hard to handle.
Go Team Zoe!
Cavendish, Di Gregorio, Fothen, Kirchen
, Kreuziger, Lowe, Siutsou
, Ten Dam
, Y.Trofimov and Vandevelde
Yeah
and the number of paydays is dwindling rapidly. Let’s face it, the incentives are all $$—can I make more if I cheat? At least for a domestique; why else would he?
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Not a surprise.
The recent article (I’d link, but can’t remember where I saw it) on the difficulties involved with catching EPO users with current testing procedures was quite revealing and alarming. I fear EPO micro dosing is still a big problem. Some of these guys, particularly from teams without an internal testing program, still think they can get away with this.
quick!
hide the hair gel!
hopefully, possession of massive quantiites of hair gel is not a criminal offense under french law. the police search will certainly find plenty of it.
as a side note, nibali and kreuziger have joined the i’m doping free thingy with cunego.
at least Triki didn't join it
the logo is awful
by King of Doping on Jul 11, 2008 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
silly, eh?
it’s some amateur cyclist in italy who came up with the idea. he sells tatoos – temporary ones – for 1 euro each. kinda hokey.
si...
i put it in a gossip column a week or so ago. the smiley face made me giggle. i couldn’t resist.
well, Cunego looks clean
as he gets dropped on any climb steeper than 2%. Maybe the new ink is weighing him down.
How ever this story turns out,
it has spoiled my Tour already.
I was so pissed that Astana (the few teams with an inside AD program together with Columbia, CSC and Garmin), got booted, for ridiculous reasons.
Think what you want of the team, but if they pass the tests they should’ve been there, unlike Liqui that has NO anti-doping program, as doesn’t Rabo, Lotto, Liqui or Caisse have either….
nah, don't let it spoil it
We knew this was coming.
I nearly posted a diary asking for bets on when we got our first positive, just before the tour. But I decided to try and uphold the myth that we’d get a clean tour.
It would take someone like CVV or Voeckler to get nailed to spoil it, for me.
well at least they are doing more than the other teams??
I never said passing a dope test ment they were clean, but the likehood that you have a ad-testing within your team makes it more likely that the riders are clean, no?
"passing tests"
I think Bruce used that as shorthand for demonstrating a clean profile. In the case of teams using extensive testing and providing months’ of various data from which trends can be detected, that’s more than passing a test.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Bruce -
I hope you don’t let this spoil this tour. I would be very disappointed if a positive or two to three would not be found. We know there are idiots who are so used to it that they will not be able to go with out. I much prefer them being caught and quickly and and cleanly being removed. Send out the message and continue to discourage it. I hope the riders continue to make the stand that THEY won’t stand for it either.
For it me, I’m finding this to be a really really exciting Tour. The course and stage mix ups done have been pretty exciting so far. This is so far from a dull first week. It’s kept me (painfully) on the edge of my seat all week. I’m super excited and I’m finding some comfort in believing in the riders I love. We have to keep catching the bad guys. This is not the worst thing. Disappointed in him but happy he got caught.
"The most wasted day is that in which we have not laughed."
Wasn't Triki the rider
whose salary Lance paid personally the year after he retired? So that he could be kept on the team?
so he's the one with the goods on Lance, you mean?
Time for an extortion probe? That would at least be new and different.
Yeah. But he was still a part owner
and when Johan said there wasn’t enough money in the budget to rehire Triki for 2006, Lance undertook to pay the salary out of his own pocket. Or so I read.
so what happens next?
Is he now suspended or dq’d? Does anyone even wait for his B-sample? Is Liqui out of the whole race? What is his suspencion if the B-test is positive too? And what happens if that’s negative? 1-2-4years? TdF not under the UCI rules, so he could maybe race UCI races?
What a mess.
Liquigas could not be invited to the Vuelta
According to the director of the race. No Bennati for the Vuelta?
Thus begins
the descent into madness. They can say it’s all because of one rider, but unlike other teams Liquigas haven’t done their part to stop the problems.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
btw, off topic
but there are some comments from cunego today in gazzetta. wanted to translate, but uh…
No worries
Since I have my five gigantic fathead posters of Benna around my bedroom- and I suspect you do too- then not seeing the Most Beautiful Man In The Peloton is not a problem.
Vuelta
verging on negatively interesting. I mean, once you hit zero interest, then what?
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Leaky quote
From CN’s coverage:
“We will await the outcome of further investigations and at the same time, albeit with pain, we are prepared to take stricter measures, with full respect for the values that has always been evident in our team.”
Now they’ll get strict? Sorry, I can’t follow everything they do about doping, but between this and the hasty Basso signing, they are a PR nightmare.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:11 PM EDT reply actions
Yep
You can book their non-attendance now.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
depressing
As an alternative to the tattoos, I like the “clean is cool” line of cycling clothing from a major German online cycling shop.
http://www.bobshop.de/en/article/anti-doping-jersey-clean-is-cool-1/
by cyclingchallenge on Jul 11, 2008 3:15 PM EDT reply actions
Like it!
Vaguely similar to Barcelona’s anti-racism kit from recent years. Too bad it’s priced in Euros.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
since it was contested at the time...
I left this bit out of the main story. But:
In the ‘99 samples case, there were three riders who returned positive results for epo during the prologue according to the report written by Ressiot. One of those three riders, I believe, was Beltran. Little wonder, he joined the list for targetted testing.
Yup
I was going to point the 99 tests out as well, but I’m trying to hang back re: the doping thing. In part because I think the other guy who had EPO in his 99 urine is a bigger part of the problem then the guys still using hotsauce.
On the one hand, I’m like Mr. Hand. (Fast Times at Ridgemont High), on the other I HATE the way riders who are unlucky enough to get caught are treated like they are the entire problem. i.e., “now that we’ve got that dirty cheater Tricki out of the way, we can go back to a clean tour.”
I’m glad he got busted and I hope his example will change some minds, but he’s a symptom, not the disease itself.
Brooklyn Chewing Gum: Vlaanderens Mooiste
Too right
and I doubt they’ll ever be completely rid of the disease. Though I have to admit I prefer that the cheater be caught than the situation in, say for example, the NFL, where there is flagrant drug cheating but everyone turns a blind eye. Good message to be sending the kids, eh?
Shmucks
Can we just fast-forward to 2010 or something, when all the guys from pre-Puerto are out of cycling? The peloton is generally changing its ways, but clearly not all the old dogs.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Thats why you want to vomit when you hear Amadio
Already spreading “the one bad seed”-comments. I just wish they would catch one or two of the dirty teammanagers redhanded so they could hang some of those out to dry as well.
Interestingly, in 1999 Beltran was not on Postal
Didn’t join till 2003.
I don't think so
Fuentes was with ONCE at that time, wasn’t he?
ONCE? Or Astana as we should now be calling them
No, I’ve just checked and at that time he was the Kelme doctor.
Banesto
is now more or less Caisse d’Epargne, although the lineage consists mostly of DS Eusebio Unzue, now that Jose Echevarri is retired. Anyway, they’re not linked to Fuentes or Once.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions
The name that usually comes up in these stories
is Jose Aramendi of ONCE and US Postal.
I don’t believe he worked for Banesto.
Brooklyn Chewing Gum: Vlaanderens Mooiste
aremendi, yeah
i was thinking of him. but wasn’t there a doc that worked with indurain? or was that aramendi. bah, i get these idiots all confused.
I'm emailing you!
nothing urgent.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
wow
making a criminal issue of doping may well be the solution …. it would terrify me
(and cyclists have cute butts)
by cyclingchallenge on Jul 11, 2008 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Me neither in principle
But do you think David Millar would be doing what he’s doing for the sport right now if the french police hadn’t hauled him in and given him the Sipowitz-treatment?
I always thought that Millar got locked up for possession
not for testing positive. He had the EPO vials in his house, right? Anyone know the legal story with Millar?
He'd
erm, kept the empty syringe as a souvenir. As you do. He was never charged because the police couldn’t prove that he had injected in France.
Thanks
That new doping law linked to above sounds like it only applies to trafficking, not to usage, and the toughening up part was just to increase the minimums. Maybe usage was already illegal in France as sporting fraud, or something like that? But if not, I would wager that unless Beltran had a box of the stuff, he will just be spending a night or two in jail like Millar did…
I vaguely remember Millar
saying something like the police threatened to keep him in jail until he confessed. Whether that had any legal standing or was just a bit of good cop bad cop is a different matter.
um, well, if it happens to be illegal to have it...
not as a racer, I mean, but as anyone without a prescription…
once it’s in the news, are the cops supposed to turn a blind eye?
(We can have the “should possession of any drug be illegal” argument again, but…let’s not, this once.)
Exactly
In most cases the use of the drugs in question would require a prescription. No prescription, Mr Beltran? You’re busted.
also, france is a sporting fraud country
that is, it’s a criminal offense to dope. not saying that’s right or wrong, just how it is.
yes, odd especially in that it's perfectly OK for riders to make a deal
as to who will win what in a stage (e.g. when the riders of a break work together, or any other way). If playoff teams in other sports shook hands and said, “We’ll win this one by two points, and let you win the next one, so they playoff goes to seven games?” You’d have a massive investigation info fixing. (That’s why I have always wondered about people who bet actual money on the outcome of a stage or race…raw talent and stated goals are only the starting point for strategy.)
Technically it's not OK
somewhere in the UCI rules is one that says something like “riders from different teams may not work together” But what would the sport be like if they tried to enforce it.
that, and...
There cooperation on the road, where by teams or riders with common interests work together and there’s buy and selling stages. The necessity for cooperation, that’s built into the sport – if the riders in the break don’t work together, they will be caught. We expect when we see a GC rider work with a stage hunter in a break that the GC rider will not likely contest the finish. Maybe they do, maybe they don’t. I don’t know the unwritten rules of other sports well enough to come up with an analogy, but it is how the sport is played in cycling. In this way, such cooperation is transparent. We are surprised when it doesn’t happen.
Buying and Selling, well, yes that does happen. Everyone knows it does, but it is never to be spoken of publicly, because if it came to the ears the commissaires it would be sanctioned. This was part of the flap over the Simoni-Basso fireworks at the Giro a year ago, and the federation called both riders in for a chat.
So, I see no contradiction between the rules and sporting fraud laws.
If I were...
the DS of Columbia, Astana, Garmin, or CSC I would find it mighty tempting to whisper in say Roman Kreuziger’s agent’s ear that perhaps he might like to jump ship.
Why? LIQ will only have trouble getting into ASO races
They can still ride…......eehhh….... the Eneco Tour….... can’t they?
the rumor is that he got some strong offers in the days between Suisse and the Tour
even if he has a contract with Liquigas until 2010
by King of Doping on Jul 11, 2008 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I was wondering that too.
I went with Kreuziger because he ain’t Italian and that’s all. Nabbing Nibali would be a coup too.
Hee Hee. I misread this at first
News of the positive test was confirmed by the Amaury Sport Organization, which runs the Tour, and the French Anti-Doping Agency, after it was initially reported by L’Equipe, a French sports daily that is also owned by Amaury.
I thought they were saying ASO ran the French Anti-Doping Agency. That would explain a lot. Then I saw the comma.
So, does anyone think that Liquigas will pull the plug like T-Mobile?
If I just had one more gear, I...
there is a story here I think
about how this race is being examined by the french anti-doping agency and not under UCI rules due to the ASO – UCI argument.
I am not suggesting what the story is ….. but definitely a story (several different and obvious angles)
by cyclingchallenge on Jul 11, 2008 5:06 PM EDT reply actions
Not to spread baseless rumours
but there is some speculation on French forums over whether Moreau was one of the others who got a letter. No-one quite understands why he just stopped and got off his bike.
interesting
i wondered if it were something like that when he suddenly abandoned. clearly, i’m not the only one. but wouldn’t he have been prevented from riding sooner under the french anti-doping regime? heh, hard to say, really.
I guess that
we will all be watching the start line extra carefully tomorrow to see who has come down with a mysterious sickness in the night.
a lot of talk on french forums about Moreau & Gadret's sudden abandons
and Moreau’s history with Festina, well….
guess i'm still skeptical
that too many french riders are involved in lettergate. mostly because they would already have been under this kind of scrutiny.
dunno.
Jegou abandoned because of a broken wrist. but the reasons for Gadret and Moreau are unclear. Even Moreau’s team’s statements are completely ambiguous – check out this eurosport.fr article
that is interesting
i saw that article, but hadn’t had the chance to read it. very bizarre. i feel very suspicious today.
jegou, si, we all saw that crash. he had surgery, also, already.
I'd hate to be a tree in France today
when everyone starts looking for believable ways to abandon the race.
Roadfurniture and eager spectators should also use caution today.
But then don't forget
Vaughters’ “rumors and speculation about which I have no personal knowledge as to their truth or factual basis” that “Moreau never had a hematokrit over 39”
Only report I could find...
... from The Guardian…
Former French champion Christophe Moreau was one of three riders to pull out of the Tour de France on Friday.
Agritubel’s Moreau, fourth overall in 2000, retired at the feed zone with 73.6 kms to go during the seventh stage, a 159-km ride from Brioude to Aurillac.
Article (such as it is) here...
After a hard day of watching a Tour stage, I like to unwind with Verbotene Liebe
Moreau is a baby
and always has been. If one thing doesn’t go well he bags it. I am not defending him, just saying he has a history of quitting. I would guess this is a case of the quits.
by australopithecine on Jul 11, 2008 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Beltran-Armstrong
I never thought the smoking gun on Beltran was his association with Armstrong. He only did one good Tour for Postal—in 2003. He was weak in 2004 and 2005, and wasn’t even good enough to be selected for the Tour in 2006.
The smoking gun was that he suddenly improved again dramatically in 2007 at age 36, finishing top-15 at the Tour and winning stages in other events.
What’s weird about the whole USPostal phenomenon is how many guys dramatically improve their performance after they leave—and that they all seem to get caught.
Don't get me wrong
I think USP/Disco had some sort of team doping program, including some combo of testosterone, maybe IGF/insulin, maybe EPO minidosing. But it was small stuff, aimed to help a few mountain domestiques recover a bit better. Several of their quality Tour riders probably weren’t in on the program at all. In fact, I think USP guys were just into the doping culture enough to be morally relativistic about it, but taking so little that they knew that they were at a huge competitve disadvantage relative to guys on other teams and probably Armstrong himself . The frustration led them to the far end of the dark side once they left.
Landis, Hamilton, Heras, Beltran. Pena obviously went darkside to finish top-10 GC at the megadoped Giro. I wouldn’t count out Boonen or VandenBroeck, even though they left at a much younger age…
by Mr 60 Percent on Jul 11, 2008 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Counter-theory
If some/any/all of your top guys are dirty, you may want all of your small guys to be implicated, in some tiny way, as well. (At least, anyone who knows about a bigger guy doing it.) To squash blackmail, and the “disgruntled employee” syndrome.
(Ever been the person who doesn’t want even a cosmetic puff at a passed joint, and gotten the suspicious, “will s/he turn us in” look? Then you understand that sort of group-think.)
I do buy the idea that low-level use removes a barrier to later use at higher levels—it’s a “virginity loss” process. (Heh…that makes Rock Racing a “reclaiming virginity” operation… pretty funny… maybe they can all join promise keepers.)
French News
seems to be playing this down a lot. The news programmes I’ve seen start with a race report and then finish it with a little PS about Beltran.
Of course not
I mean, it’s calciomercato season. Also, what’s Roberto Mancini wearing now?
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
So, if ASO were sticking by their own rules,
they’d dump and fine every team whom’s rider tests positive?
Didn’t think so too either…
I know,
but that’s what ASO said.
Is Ligui getting now a 100.000 euro bill to fund the ffc?
Ridiculous.
Now you're being negative
just look at all the column inches they are getting in return for that 100.000
Ha!
I’d take the 100.000 euros, fine thanks, if I had won the lottery or earned the money some other way, like closing a big deal etc. But busting a rider for doping and earning money??
I don’t like it.
Heh
Hey, the one distinction with Astana is the two years’ worth of headaches. Having said that, don’t shoot, I’m the messenger.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmmm...
Telekom=T-Mobile=High Road=Team Columbia.
That is almost a decade of doping, where their docs were busted for a massive drug program.
+ Most of the DC’s & ex-riders have admitted doping…
Si
but all those guys are gone. Wait… never mind.
"If writing too much about the Classics is wrong, I don't want to be right."
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 11, 2008 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
astana was not invited to the Tour because they embarrassed and more importantly cost $$$ to ASO for 2 years
in a row, even after making promises that the team was changed, that all the bad apples were gone.
ASO must be regretting the 'contract' they signed with the teams before the Tour
where it states that if a rider is found positive, it would be up to the team to decide if it sayed or not unless it was found (somehow) to be team-approved/managed doping
Naw, that was a good deal for both sides
the ASO can point to it and tell critical advertisers that “it is out of our hands” and the teams can continue to turn a blind eye to the riders obeying their unspoken instructions.
Brooklyn Chewing Gum: Vlaanderens Mooiste
We need several more
Jesus Manzanos and Jorg Jakshes to come clean and verify whether or not systematic doping existed within teams.
(I’m sure that several types of doping programs-team run ala Saiz, free-lance ala Raimondas Rumsas, and “nudge-nudge, wink-wink” ala Giancarlo Ferretti’s “advice” to Dario Frigo-existed and probably continue to exist,
SO, the sporting sanctions need to be shifted so that the principals of a management company (e.g. Riis Cycling, High Road, or Slipstream—but NOT necessarily the sponsoring company) loses the right to organize sponsorship with companies or contract with riders for a specified period if one of their riders is deemed to have tested positive after all of the various appeals processes have worked through.
AND cyclists need to risk a work stoppage in order to develop a meaningful cyclists’ union. In that sense, the collapse of the UCI might be a good thing if it could prompt the emergence of a powerful riders’ union.
by R Mc on Jul 11, 2008 7:42 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Part of me says "what a good idea"
The rest of me says, “the cyclists’ union, such as it is, mostly worked AGAINST doping checks and controls, for years.”
agreed
and the model of strong athletes’ unions like in MLB and NFL isn’t exactly encouraging, either . . . but the situation for cyclists as it stands in professional Cycling, where you can have a tool like Michael Ball who engages in highly questionable hiring/contracting procedures, and is then celebrated for throwing a small chunk of cash towards an injury pension fund, is all but intolerable.
HEY R Mc! Step away from the rational thinking there!
Come on! Step back and no one gets hurt! More clear thinking like that and you’ll be in trouble!
VS is showing their prime-time coverage now, with absolutely no mention
of Beltran’s results. I know it’s a taped show, but I thought for sure they’d have a “crawl” like last year.
One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor. - George Carlin
other doping news (like the new title for this thread BTW): VV blood bag is still/again in play
Spanish Authorities have 6 months to hand over VV’s bag…or…else….what? The CAS will ban Spain?
In Murilo Fischer diary
he not say much more.
Only was relieved that Liquigas continue in the Tour, and today it bit a circus at front of hotel, with many reporters.
The all team was surprised, and had a big tension in the team.
“Às vezes agente acha que conhece bem as pessoas, mas depois se engana com elas, muito chato isso.”
Sometimes we think that we know well that person, but afterward we made a mistake.
National biases
It is always a bit strange for me how fans and media of a given country can turn a blind eye to their own stars re: doping and yet criticise others
I can’t understand why David Millar is such a hero and seen as a role model by so many brits. Bizarre. I find it nauseating that after being caught red handed he now feels he has the right to lecture others about doping.
Likewise, the french lionized guys like Virenque despite his part in the Festina debacle and yet many love to throw dirt at Armstrong.
Personally, applying tough criminal charges against blatant dopers is a great idea to save the sport.
by cyclingchallenge on Jul 12, 2008 2:03 AM EDT reply actions
lol, and katiek saves me the effort of updatin'
grazie, girl :-)
i’ll toss a little update in the main story anyway…
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