Retractionheimer
I'm the guy who posted the thread early this year attaching the tag "wheelsucking" to a thread about Levi's team protesting a loss of time for him.
And Levi has now won another GT time trial, this time attacking his own teammate on the penultimate day of the most important race for Astana this year.
I formally retract any accusation of wheelsucking at Levi, and I will order an Astana jersey later today. Despite my impending jersey order, my most fervent hope is that some team buys Levi's contract out and then lets him win whichever GT Contador doesn't enter next year. Because I think he could, and now, I hope he does.
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16 comments
Comments
Just don't...
buy the Astana USA Champions jersey.
Bad Super Hero Styling
Racing for Victory and Free Beer!
by DemonCats on Sep 20, 2008 4:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
sigh
I so wanted Levi to win . . . what an effort!
by cg. on Sep 20, 2008 4:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Could he have won?
I haven’t watched enough of the Vuelta to know.
1. Levi and Contador would be tied on time if there were no time bonuses.
2. Levi had to lead Contador uphill on the two climbs that produced time splits.
3. After Contador went off the front to create time gaps on the climbs, Levi could not chase him until his win was secured.
4. Levi won both individual time trials.
Just curious as to what others think if Contador had ridden for Levi instead of the other way around, would he have had enough time on Contador to win? If Levi was on another team, could he have made up enough time in the TTT, ITTs, and in chasing on the climbs to catch Contador?
by John.. on Sep 20, 2008 5:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He couldn't have won.
There’s two things bug about about this Let Levi Win argument. First is that Leipheimer has shown his class by the way he’s taken his defeat. On the chin. No whining. No bitching. No trying to rewrite the results. The contrary in fact.
“Alberto performed where he needed to. On the Angliru he showed he was the best. […] Alberto really deserves this win.”
“A big factor was that Alberto was the big favourite and I was pretty relaxed. For him to carry that weight, with all the fans of Spain looking to him and to win his third grand tour in the shortest time in history, he really deserves this. He performed when he needed to – there’s no discussion.”
Then there’s the argument that without bonifications – the Vuelta’s hanging chads – the two would have been tied on time and separated only by decimals of a second. Which fall in Leipheimer’s favour and so therefore he’s the moral victor. Leipheimer is the new Al Gore. All hail the new saviour of cycling.
But let’s look at what actually happened on the road. On stage seven, In the closing klicks of an uphill finish, Contador attacks, takes 5" on the road from Leipheimer and another 8" in bonifications. Without those bonifications though, who’s to say Contador wouldn’t have gone sooner / harder? Let’s remember what Sastre said about him, about him being an ant, taking seconds here and seconds there, a boring number-crunching second-counting little ant.
The next day, similar story. 5" to Contador on the road with an attack on the closing climb, another 8" in bonifications. Another question as to whether he’d have gone harder / sooner wihthout those bonifications waiting for him.
Stage 12, Leipheimer surrenders 3" on the road as the finish kicked uphill.
Stage 13, l’Angliru. Contador drops Leipheimer, putting 1’05" into him, plus another 20" in bonifications. Leipheimer simply couldn’t stay with him when the road went up.
Stage 14, In the closing klicks of an uphill finish, Leipheimer surrenders 2" on the road and another 8" in bonifications. He coulda gone for those bonus seconds himself if he’d had the legs, couldn’t he?
Stage 20. Leipheimer takes 31" out of Contador in the final TT. But Contador knew how much time he could afford to surrender, didn’t he? He was 11" down at km9. At km12, he was holding the deficit at 11". In the final 5 kilcks, he surrenders 20" to his teammate. He could well afford to. Would he have surrendered them if he couldn’t have afforded to?
The whole point is, you take out the bounuses, you create a whole other race. It wouldn’t just affect how Leipheimer and Contador would have played the race. It would affect how everyone would have played the race. Would it have been harder, faster, more breaks, more splintering in the closing kicks, especially the uphill ones, who woulda lost time they didn’t? You don’t know.
Yet some think they know enough to think Contador is the Vuelta’s Dubya and won the race unfairly. Thank God Leipheimer has more class than Al Gore, that’s all I can say.
pounding along in three ratios like a sonata
like a Ritter with pommelled scrotum atra cura on the step
Botticelli from the fork down pestling the transmission
tires bleeding voiding zeep the highway
by fmk on Sep 21, 2008 7:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hear you, and even without the time bonuses,
Contador would’ve won,
from VN
Even more interesting; had the Vuelta followed the lead of this year’s Tour, and not offered time bonuses, Leipheimer and Contador would have tied for the overall.
Contador earned 58 seconds in bonuses, including 40 seconds in his two stage victories. Leipheimer earned 12 seconds in bonuses, from his second place at Fuentes de Invierno, but didn’t earn any bonuses in his two time trial victories. the tie-breaker, measured in decimals taken in time trials, would have tilted toward Contador, however. Contador’s decimals were 0.0570 while Leipheimer’s came down to 0.1240.
Contador carried the weight of being a favourite, and as Levi said he performed when he had to.
by Bruce Suomi on Sep 21, 2008 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't really matter anyways
It’s not a defeat if you are not given the green light in the first place. Contador was always going to be the leader, so Levi didn’t lose because he was never in the running in the first place.
If I just had one more gear, I...
by SpunOut on Sep 21, 2008 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course he lost, but what I meant was
He was never really competing with Contador. It’s like running a 5k but knowing that you are not putting any really effort into it. He put effort into the TTs and protecting Bert’s lead, but none in trying to win.
If I just had one more gear, I...
by SpunOut on Sep 21, 2008 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
He could have, should have and would have won…..too bad.
Save The Legs!!!
by jack376 on Sep 20, 2008 6:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
‘cept of course he wasn’t the marked man contador was, which makes a world of difference.
fact is, when it mattered most, in the mountains, he didn’t have the legs to keep up with contador.
pounding along in three ratios like a sonata
like a Ritter with pommelled scrotum atra cura on the step
Botticelli from the fork down pestling the transmission
tires bleeding voiding zeep the highway
by fmk on Sep 20, 2008 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
how do you know he didn’t have the legs? he didn’t attack because team tactics dictated that he mark the riders behind contador. in other words, we would never know. its incorrect to say he didn’t have the legs. clearly he did. however, you are correct in saying he wasn’t the marked man and therefore may not have had the pressure as contador did. again, we would never know. the fact is, he road strongly and without time bonuses, would be tied w/ contador. and if he were allowed to ride for himself? i’d say, “watch out!”.
Save The Legs!!!
by jack376 on Sep 20, 2008 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lets hope he keeps the form...
and wins the Worlds TT next week. That will be an excellent consolation prize and a gift that will keep on giving throughout the year.
I am sure he had pressure but I agree with fmk, different race if he was the leader. Sastre was able to mark him AFTER he marked and chased Contador and Valv.
As for working for Bert, other than 2 or three digs on final climbs – he was riding like a leader since Astana was the most stacked team.
And I am not so sure those digs weren’t for personal gain. Think about the Schleks and Sastre on D’Huez – If Andy or Franck could have gotten away – they would have. Same sitch here.
by humbug1 on Sep 20, 2008 6:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
impressed at anyone making the effort of a proper retraction
Respect to you Softie, lots of respect!
by JFS_PGH on Sep 21, 2008 12:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Gore conceded. Whether that was class or not is up to interpretation.
However, what’s not up to interpretation is that we’re supposed to steer clear of heavy-handed political digs here, except for the very few cases (HWMNBN) where they have a very direct cycling connection to excuse them. That is one of Chris’s few cardinal rules.
A bit of nudge-nudge wink-wink is one thing, especially where a political figure is also a pop culture figure, or crass fun can be had (Bill Clinton cigar jokes, GW flight suit jokes). Making a statement conditional on your P.O.V. might also fly. But assuming that your fellow PC readers, and the rest of the world, should automatically agree that a) Gore clearly lost and b) his actions after that point were classless, as the basis for your metaphor? I’d call you on that. However you feel about it, it’s not an issue that belongs here.
by JFS_PGH on Sep 21, 2008 11:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Well said,
JFS. Your comment saved me from possibly taking the bait. Thanks.
by huy on Sep 22, 2008 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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