Thomas Dekker Out of the Tour!
by Frinking on Jul 1, 2009 8:50 AM EDT
Email
Print
Silence-Lotto's Thomas Dekker will not start in the Tour, says organizers ASO. Dekker tested positive for EPO in an out of competition control 2 years ago. He rode for Rabobank at that time. The test was held in December, 2007. The reason why he just tested positive is because they couldn't track EPO during the test. In 2008 Thomas Dekker has suspicious bloodvalues so they retested the samples from 2007. With the better equipment the test was positive.
Rabo had signs about the strange blood values last year. This was actually the reason he didn't go to the Tour, and why he never rode for Rabobank again. He's the third rider who signed for Silence who tested positive. None of them were their fault but that's tragic isn't it?
p.s. if there are editors who want to edit/correct the mistakes. Be my guest! [Ed: done!]
Source (Dutch)
Results 2007 He won the TA and Romandie
P.p.s Ooo and! Wegelius is his replacement in the Tour
Chris's Soapbox: This shoe was waiting to drop for a long time, IMHO. I think a number of us had this very concern when he and Rabobank had their falling out last year. I also had the pleasure of riding with a former Dutch pro who lives in Seattle now and who knows a lot of the current generation (though he's my age). He pretty flatly stated that Rabo are extremely skittish about doping in general, and that Dekker looked like trouble to them, for unspecified reasons. Well, here you go. Consequently, this doesn't really bother me. It's sad, seeing a young, special talent go this route, but given this background Dekker was one of the cases waiting to get taken up. I say let's get it over with; maybe during his long vacation he'll rediscover the real sport of cycling.
260 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Devastating news indeed
Can’t it just go away?
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Ohhh I'm Devasted... No Tommy.. You were one of my favourites :-(((((((((
Have to go to bed, and hopefully this will have disappeared.. Tears are coming..
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
I know how it feels to have a favourite in this situation
Just gotta hope for the best and then if you can continue to support him do (i am for one of my faves) and if you can’t….well, i never did forgive Tyler for his first positive
"When he accelerates, he's like Superman emerging from the telephone booth!" La Gazzetta journo Paolo Condo talking about Edvald Boasson Hagen.
Eek, guess that explains why Rabo didn't want anything to do with him
Silence-Lotto are gonna be one pissed team. Plus Dekker may have been useful for Evans. Maybe.
"When he accelerates, he's like Superman emerging from the telephone booth!" La Gazzetta journo Paolo Condo talking about Edvald Boasson Hagen.
Sporza had a comment from Seargent that Google mangled...
…but which I think boils down to, ‘he wasn’t riding for us at the time, but this is horrid,’ so yeah.
*Lotto
So how many newly signed riders ended up being dopers. Sucks to be Cadel, can’t find any help anywhere.
Surprise--not.
And I actually do hold * Lotto responsible for taking a massively suspicious case. Don’t know how I feel about the other two, but everything—from his pattern of good and bad rides, to his sudden mystery illnesses when rumors of testing came around, said “doping.” Lotto? What’s the line between being innocently ignorant, and being culpably blind? I think they were greedy, and wanted a better rider than they could afford, so they went with people other teams wouldn’t touch. NO, this does not reflect on the good people on the team, but it does reflect on the management.
Some remarks
1) Bad news for Evans. Serious blow to the strength of his team.
2) What’s this with the retesting of 1½ year old samples? How many positives will they find if they retest 1-5 year old samples of all tour participants?
3) I won’t win the VDS yearlong this year. It’s unfair!
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
wielernieuws says Sergeant has called Wegelius to Monaco
Not a bad replacement unless his form is way off.
I believe Sporza said something similar.
I was relying on Google Translate for that, though, so who knows what it actually said.
Well this is awfully, horribly depressing.
But the slight silver lining, if you can call it that, is that I’m pleased for Wegelius….
Adrenalina Italiana!
BIO passport
you have probably already seen this by now, but it looks like they are just looking for a sure-fire way to nail him. This Velonews article makes it sound like he has had inappropriate blood values for a while.
Can't help but feel that this has been known before
Somewhere in this neverending saga of uncertainty around Dekker someone has known this but have not wanted to deal with it. I’ll wait for more details before I say more but I bet this could have been dealt with long before.
L'Equipe has it now as well
Article here
My translation: “Three days from the start of Tour de France, this Saturday in Monaco, Thomas Dekker (Silence) has tested positive for EPO as a result of new analysis performed on samples dated December 24, 2007. His team, which was notified of this Monday, has stated that the rider naturally will not participate in the grade boucle. Cadel Evans thus loses his principle lieutenant.”
Christmas Eve
He and Boogerd have complained about this particular testing in the press. “It’s Christmas Eve, give us a break”. I guess that test was an unpleasant surprise for TD at the time. Counting on a nice and quiet EPO-Christmas.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
What the hell kind of traditions do you have there in the low countries?
I will not accept any lutefisk-badmouthing from here on.
'Twas the night before christmas...
and all through the house, Thomas Dekker was peeing in a cup, trembling like a scared mouse…
If you are trembling like a scared mouse
it’s probably ill advised to pee in a cup “all through the house”.
You know? Carpet-stains and all.
What's the problem
a bit of soap and voila, angel juice
wow
comment of the week? gonna be tough to top!
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
No no no! Cecchini is just a kind helpful gentleman
and so wealthy too. Why would he be aiding anyone to dope? That’s ludicrous.
(where is that irony-emoticon by the way)
The trouble with "Cecchini = guilt" is
that if you believe that, you have to believe that everyone who trained with him is also a doper—not just the likes of Cancellara, Breschel, Kirchen, and Flecha (among others) but clean poster boys St. Leenooos of Munster and post-ban David Millar.
Maybe Cecchini provided dope or connections to it, but it does seem that at least some riders just went to him for training. For what it’s worth Jaksche, who wasn’t shy about blowing the whistle on Fuentes, said he only got training programs from Cecchini and never even spoke with him about doping.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Si
Tend to think the Ceccho connection is a mixed bag, as you say here. After the Ferrari trial, the Italian police raided Ceccho’s place and kept him under a fair amount of scrutiny. I tend to think at that point, he was not directly providing anyone with doping products. Those riders who asked probably got a “referral” though, and it’s hard to imagine they weren’t getting advice from him, given his knowledge.
Tend to think some clients of Ceccho may well have gone for the training advice. Hard to know for sure, though.
I agree with you both here
As with Ferrari there is no doubt he is very qualified trainer. I think there might be a case to be made that Riis benefitted just as much from his innovative powerbased training (that is now used by everyone) as from any meds he may or may not have provided.
Mostly I find it funny how all connected riders use the same template for defending Cecchini (basically the things I said in my original post). You sometimes get the feeling they were reading them off a cheat-sheet.
Agreed
Though I would make a distinction between Ferrari and Cecchini – when the Italians investigated Ferrari, they convicted him, though it was over-turned on procedural grounds. A similar investigation of Cecchini did not find sufficient evidence to open a case. Or, Ceccho simply had more money to buy off the local prosecutor ;-)
It’s a difficult thing the connection between so many riders and these two, who have so often been connected with nefarious doings.
There is always the possibility
that Riis is the dirty connection, not Cecchini, when you look at what Cecchini-clients have actually been caught.
Si, for sure
The reporting by the Frankfurt paper with the silly long name suggests that Riis introduced his riders to Fuentes – or at least, was present when they met the Spanish doctor. That would put Ceccho out of the loop, though the Puerto evidence pointed to a connection between the two docs.
Has anyone seen the nature of that connection?
[ Jens excuses himself for 3 minutes to go on profanity laced tirade agains ythe Spanish in general and their justice system in particular]
Hmm
There were phone calls between the two, heh, it’s been a long time. Ceccho explained the connection as personal, having to do maybe with cancer in one of their families.
LOL, where’s Majope? If she can resurrect Davis’s doping program, surely she has this deet at hand ;-)
The only thing I can find in the Puerto docs
(or rather, the summaries that appeared in AS) is a reference to a messages passed between Fuentes and Cecchini, but the translation is utterly garbled:
In connection with this assumption, in the crowded case 99/06 was preparing CASERO the Tour of Spain in 2001 on the sources made certain statements in the press which said he had called CASERO to convey a message your doctor Luigi Cecchini FUENTES who maintain a friendly relationship, and that would do the same Cecchini often leading source when runners competing in Italy.
Original Spanish—anyone?
En relación con esta suposición, en el atestado 99/06 se refería el caso la preparación de CASERO en la Vuelta a España del año 2001 sobre el que FUENTES realizó determinadas declaraciones en prensa en las cuales afirmaba había llamado a CASERO para transmitirle un mensaje de su médico Luigi CECCHINI con quien FUENTES mantendría una relación de amistad, y que CECCHINI haría lo mismo frecuentemente con corredores que llevaba FUENTES cuando competían en Italia.
The cancer thing: I’m pretty sure Cecchini said that he advised Fuentes when F.‘s daughter had eye cancer—I had a link to the article, but it’s offline right now.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
So the 100 million dollar question?
Is this another ‘bio-passport’ result? Targeted testing / retesting?
And to continue for the microwave
How will retesting of old samples hold in court?
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Yes, with a mutual vow of silence
But it was internal blood value testing (evaluating) that did him in, not the bio passport because that didn’t exist back then.
Well, it did.
The results were being collected and could be sent by UCI to other teams. This came up with Kohl and why Garmin didn’t take him. They just weren’t being used for enforcement purposes yet.
I had thought Garmin asked for the official data
but were given some nonsense by his manager instead?
Yes
I posted this last year. What happened later was that Dekker got a letter from the UCI that acknowledged that Dekker’s values wasn’t too high, which was a bit beside the point.
Staring at the swim team gets you killed by a gang of dancing ninja men who know how to twirl.
by TheFigurehead on Jul 1, 2009 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
His website went offline....
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
It's on CN too
But I get the feeling that they have asked Google to translate an article for them.
Staring at the swim team gets you killed by a gang of dancing ninja men who know how to twirl.
and good luck and hope Wegelius has a great tour!!
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
That is not necessarily a bad thing for Evans
if Charlie is in decent form. He is a good mountain helper for sure.
aparently he is, he was expecting to go..
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
But Dekker in 2007 Tour was fabolous. Rod the bunch for kilometers after each other.
Maybe that was too good on his age but he had so much talent. Or so it seemed(sp?)
Especially considering that debacle at the Worlds
where Wegelius “forgot” he was riding for Britain and helped his italian teammates instead. Oooops!
Not exactly a Team Sky candidate, is he?
Not sure Brailsford has spoken to him since. Still, I look forward to the snarky comments about bad hotels.
fill like spilling the beans on everything now.. but i'll sleep on it :-)
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
Please define 'everything'
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Just something I was told ...
But need sleep, so bed time it is.. I’m just angry at sad at the moment.. Damn him..
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
Ummm...haven't we discussed before how 'something I was tolded' ought to rest that way....
Bah....Cavendish?!
by bradBordeaux on Jul 1, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
that should read 'told'
Bah....Cavendish?!
by bradBordeaux on Jul 1, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes, I agree.
Let’s not post things told to us in private on here, especially not where they concern individuals. That’s got major problems on about six or seven different levels, some of which may be legal.
Not angry anymore, just sad..
So resting it is, and really, it has nothing to do with testing positive/drugs, so it could have been said.. and it wasn’t told in private. Just something i’ve kept private.. But doesn’t matter as I’ve woken up less revengeful this morning..
Viva Le Tour
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
i'm happy for wegelius
he is a good domestique, especially in the mountains, with experience of helping team leaders in grand tours.
and lets be honest, did anyone actually trust dekker since the rabobank fiasco? i certainly didn’t…
Yes i trusted him, :-((
"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"
Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009
Me too
With a long absence of true Dutch cycling talent we can’t be picky here in the wet, flat and windy part of the world.
Last Dutch rider to don yellow for a day was Breukink in 1989! Last monument win was in 2001. Actually 1 monument win in the last 20 years. It’s such a shame.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
it is a shame
for fans and for the sport. until cav came along, we brits were in a similar shape in terms of (untainted) heros of recent times, and when one does come along, that drought makes you cherish them all the more. so when they let you down, its even worse…millar was a prime example, for me..
Sad
But better times are ahead, and when Gesink wins stage 17 the right way, you guys can celebrate a little.
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't know about that
Huge talent for sure. But he misses the explosiveness to fly away on climbs.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
From the Silence site
Marc Coucke: We eindigen liever 4de in de Tour, dan deze te winnen met iemand die ons beloog. Wij maakten het nieuws van Thomas Dekker bekend omdat ons geen schuld treft en wij niks met doping te maken willen hebben.
We’d rather become 4th in the Tour, than win it with someone who lied to us. We published the news about TD because we are not to blame en we don’t want anything to do with doping.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
wonder what
cadel will be thinking about that statement!
"I'm leaving Marc Sergeant at home
I’d rather win the Tour than become 4th with someone who lied to me. He promised me high quality support in the Tour"
Oh BS, how can they not have seen this coming?
or at least feel there was a great chance this was coming? They should have known better just like they should have known better about Kohl.
good for them.
Hiring him = bad call, but…good for them all the same. And with luck, it means he’s now riding clean, and if his ban is retroactive, they may be able to rehab his status and get him back on the bike in a few months. Fair enough.
Coucke's Basso moment?
Dekker was available, cheap, just hanging out there. And technically there was nothing wrong. I can see how Coucke, who needs more riders, was tempted, how he talked himself into thinking that if there were a past case it wasn’t their problem. That’s wrong — hiring a guy under a cloud of suspicion makes you part of the problem. But it’s just murky enough to try anyway.
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I see how he convinced himself, when you put it that way.
But they really can’t act all blindsided by it. Ya gamble, ya lose, ya don’t whine.
This is getting pretty ridiculous now
Can we just wipe the slate clean effective immediately, offer amnesty to all the riders who doped through June 2009, and let them know in no uncertain terms that no future doping scandals will be tolerated? (I.e. lifetime bans for all future guilty partiesI I personally had no doubt that Rabobank let him go for this very reason, but barring him from starting the Tour because of a dope control in 2007 seems like excessive punishment. Sure he was a big phony, paying all this lip service to riding clean, but he’s no different then plenty of other riders in that respect. Why not also exclude Armstrong from the Tour based on 1999 his positive as well? LOL!
Blood passport.
If it’s retest based on continuing blood anomalies, that seems fair enough to me. & if it really is Dynepo, then I doubt he’ll be the last, unfortunately, since it was previously undetectable.
Could be the first of many
This is bad stuff.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
So why not nail him for something post blood passport?
If his blood values continue to be be suspicious, which I would find suprising considering his lack of results this year, wait for the opportunity to prove that he was guilty in 2009? Same logic should appy to Valverde. After all, how many riders from 2007 were likely doped? I would bet a sizeable percentage. So lets not arbitrarily pick and choose which riders take the fall and which riders get off scott free. And in particular, don’t do this 3 days before the start of the Tour.
Hmm...
Is there any UCI statute of limitations about convictions based on doping tests? I know Olympic samples are frozen for like eight years but I am unsure about the UCI since Mr McQuaid likes to change his mind.
Mon coeur appartient à les forçats de la route.
Relevant quote and source:
In cycling, the statute of limitations for doping violations is governed not by the UCI rulebook, but by provisions of the World Anti-Doping Code. Specifically, Article 17 of the WADA Code notes that "no action may be commenced against an Athlete or other Person for a violation of an anti-doping rule contained in the Code unless such action is commenced within eight years from the date the violation occurred."
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Well, no.
It’s the “amnesty” concept. If you keep wiping the slate clean, with a moving window, and say “we couldn’t test for that then, so it doesn’t count” there’s precious little reason not to use whatever the next generation of undetectable doping agent might be. Besides, Dekker was kind of obvious in his dopage, IMHO (said with no insider info, just a reaction to his riding pattern and style). I’d suggest we keep nailing, in retrospect, the riders whose blood levels kept on fluctuating in mid-late 2008 and in 2009. It should have been dead obvious by then that NOT everybody was doing it, and that yes, the powers that be are now serious.
+ 1000
Seriously, anyone who continued doping after the"Festina Affair" deserves whatever comes their way.
If that event did not serve notice that things were going to become more visible and more public (one day) then nothing would have,
Anyone doping after that event knew that they were rolling the dice. They may have decided that the odds were stacked in their favour – and for a long time they were (and perhaps they still are); but they knew that they were taking a risk.
I’d like to see retrospective testing that goes as far back as we can, whilst not compromising the results…
At the very least publish names. You want to clean the sport? You want to put some level of integrity back into the sport? Get to the point where the feeling is that the majority are riding clean? Then it is going to take something more drastic than the current approach…
"Age and treachery will overcome youth and skill" - Fausto Coppi
by muk on Jul 1, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The "Festina Affair" was a joke in terms of cleaning up the sport
The public and cycling media was naive in assuming that it would be the moment where cycling would conquer its demons and begin a new era of doping free competition. In retrospect the drug culture was too ingrained in the sport to expect such a drastic transformation in such a short period of time. Therefore I don’t think it’s unfair to scold the top riders, particularly the grand tour riders, for taking doping products when it was practically a condition for being competitive back then.
Look back at 2007, Di Luca’s rep was tarnished, Ricco’s meteoric rise was later exposed as a gigantic farce, Cunego curiously began his decline in the grand tours after becoming more outspoken about “riding drug free” and the list goes on and on. Should I mention Rasmussen and Vino? All those riders were battling it out with Dekker in the top races, more than likely with the assistance of PED’s, so why shouldn’t Dekker also enlist the aid of such products? But yet later on, presumambly after cleaning up his act given his poor 2009, he has to take the fall and others continue? If he fails a drug test IN THE PRESENT TIME by all means suspend him for 2 years, 8 years or whatever. But using a positive from 2007 seems unjust, didn’t the UCI recently say it wasn’t interested in examining Ricco’s 2008 Giro samples? Why Dekker’s samples from 2007 than?
Interesting quote from Dekker in 2008
“From January 1, 2008 we should all draw a line under the past and a make a fresh start”. (Was that an admission?) The last few years have been characterised by a lack of progress. With the blood passport, a new and severe system of controls is being put in place. (little did he know) It’s the beginning of a new phase in cycling"
Ouch. If his blood values from 2008 were suspicious he comes across as a grade A phony in this February 2008 interview. (From procycling magazine)
'cause they already caught Ricco.
They don’t want to remove people from racing, long term (when, as you said, a lot of people were still doping). They want to make being caught hurt the team and the rider, so the teams will stop putting pressure on the riders to dope, and start putting real pressure on them not to dope. Plus I assume they want to be able to tighten the thumbscrews if someone starts riding oddly again. Yes, Dekker was riding against a lot of older dopers and ex dopers, and at least a handful of young dopers. So if he wants to be a top talent at a young age, sure, there’s pressure to dope. Or he could have been a pretty good talent at a young age, and wait for his skills (and doping prosecution of others) to lift him to the top. It seems to me that there are a lot of other dedicated young (and not so young) riders out there doing exactly that.
Well, that sucks.
If it’s true, I just hope he confesses and does his time gracefully.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
And this appears to suggest we're not talking about just one instance in late 2007...
…Rabo fired him last year, fairly obviously now, because his profiles last year were screwy.
This really begins to make Lotto look less like innocent victims and more like idiots who weren’t doing their due diligence. If Rabo could figure out something was wrong, why not Lotto? I’m feeling less and less sorry for them by the second.
Saxo also said they looked at Dekker's blood profiles and didn't see anything wrong.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Similar skills to Andy Schleck
Better at TT, not as strong a climber, but similar and almost the same age. Made him not a great fit.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
The question is why not.
Rabo clearly thought something was up, but didn’t have proof. Possibly they’d gotten notice of the non-negative test, but when they were dumping him, surely the handwriting was on the wall enough for teams to subject what they were looking at to very careful scrutiny. Admittedly, if it was as inconclusive as is being claimed, they wouldn’t have cited this as a reason not to hire (for fear of lawsuit if nothing else, as Rabo surely also feared when letting him go without citing this as the reason). But I’d be very surprised if they really didn’t find it.
And if they really didn’t, does this fit with the questions being asked about Saxo’s Anti-Doping regime last year?
As I remember...
… Brian Nygaard said that they were looking on to some riders but didn’t hire them because of some Damsgaard recommendation. Thomas Dekker’s agent told last year that they were in serious contact with Saxo Bank…
by Forstoppelse on Jul 1, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
This would support my conjecture above...
…that they smelled something, but weren’t in a position to say so.
Same as Rasmussen
Tested “non-negative” for dynepo 2 years ago.
Staring at the swim team gets you killed by a gang of dancing ninja men who know how to twirl.
by TheFigurehead on Jul 1, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
At the risk of sounding like a broken record
But the Austria-conection is going to rear it’s ugly head sooner or later.
Why
That was blooddoping wasn’t it? Hard to keep track. You have to be a medical expert to become a cycling fan nowadays.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
There has quite obviously been an austrian source
Humanplasma seems to be a part of the puzzle but only part of it. Probably one source/network with multiple methods/products.
First mention of it in this case
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Ugh. Will they leave retired riders alone?
I could just about take it if it’s true about Menchov, but when it comes to Boogie I just want to bury my head in the sand.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Boogie
TD’s best pal. You better start digging…
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
La la la
I can’t hear you! I wonder how much Amstel Gold I have in the fridge…
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
And the Schlecks are palsy-walsies with Boogie too...
Darn, why must i think these thoughts!?
Mon coeur appartient à les forçats de la route.
review this previous
thread. Boogerd didn’t come clean, but he’s been hinting for a while. And he’s one of my big favorites, too. I give him a huge dispensation compared to Dekker because that really was an “[almost] everyone’s doing it” era.
Dispensation looks a bit wobbly if he got Dekker into doping, though.
If even by example. They were buddies and roommates on the road from the time Dekker came up from the development team.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
I'd like to think...
that at worst, he steered Dekker away from the most dangerous choices, if Dekker was determined to dope. As opposed to telling him that he better use something if he wanted to amount to anything. I don’t know.
DIT IS EEN DRAMA!
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Well, I think we know why a Garmin deal did not happen.
Unlike Lotto, Garmin knows how to recognize a screwy blood profile and stay the hell away.
too bad Garmin can't sue
everytime someone uses their name in the media, saying they are interested in a rider. I honestly think agents do that to say, “oh, he’s clean, trust me!”
Ooo. I hadn't thought of that. It would make sense of some of the odder connections...
…very very well taken point you have here sir.
Contador, Dekker
Garmin appears to have been busy on the transfer market. All wishful thinking imho.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Hehe, yes please. I've been saying it since last year's Vuelta, he was hanging around the Cd'E bus a little too long
"When he accelerates, he's like Superman emerging from the telephone booth!" La Gazzetta journo Paolo Condo talking about Edvald Boasson Hagen.
More like superfluous...
…besides all the other reasons why not, there’s the big one.
Third rider of Silence-Lotto to test positive?
This positive test (if it holds up as one in court …) was from before Dekker’s S-L days, of course. Anyway, who do you reckon are the other too? Not Kohl, surely?
I was wondering the same thing.
Are we getting Lotto and Katusha confused here?
Isn't editing original Frinkster posts
a sort of sacrilege?
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
I know
I’m torn over it. But it’s Tour week, so our front page needs to look nice and clean. Hey, maybe I’ll add the blood logo!
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I think we need a good doping logo if we don't already have one
Really throw these guys out there when their name gets associated with the PdC doping logo!
I did tell you, the pink pills. NOT the BLUE ones!
by tedvdw on Jul 1, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
About turn!
Ha that’s a funny image… Or tie your shoelaces? Or go through a door?
Adrenalina Italiana!
Ok. What are you trying to say...
You know.. We can go outsied.. You can smell my axilla from close, very close!
I pity the man who wears his jewelry
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
that’s one nice axilla you’re got Frinster!
by plinytheelder on Jul 1, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, and as for Silence
If a guy with a huge resume is available at a discount, there’s probably a reason.
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 AM EDT reply actions
He's going to be a huge disappointment to your captain in July?
I just assumed *Lotto consciously recruited him for that role.
Robbie Hunter on Twitter
Interesting news for Thomas Dekker.pos test from 2 years back.man its amazing always just before TDF. Well another 1 bites the dust I guess4 minutes ago from UberTwitter
I think a few ppl will be going mmm they saved his sample for that long maybe that’s a prob ha ha. Some guys sweating bullets for sure ha ha2 minutes ago from UberTwitter
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Is it just me or have the sprinters been comparatively clean?
It just occurred to me that I can’t think of a single sprinter caught up in any of this (Boonen excepted, b/c well, I simply refuse to count that is being related). Then I realized that EPO is unlikely to do much for them, since they won’t make finales on any really hard stages anyhow. At which point I began to wonder whether people like Robbie may well be able to sit pretty and laugh at a lot of these guys who are nervy b/c they simply don’t have any skeletons in the closet.
Or I could be missing something obvious and this could all be bs.
nah
EPO helps recovery – so sprinters benefit also. There’ve been cases in track and field of sprinters testing positive.
Also, I can think of at least two name sprinters who worked extensively with Cecchini.
So no, I don’t think it’s right to assume that the sprinters are cleaner than anyone else.
The recovery angle had occurred to me...
…though majope’s point about Cecchini seems fair too. But recovery would be enough, I suppose.
Yes
Also, don’t forget that rarely are these products used alone. So, the “sprinter cocktail” might vary relative to the “grand tour” cocktail for those riders who wish to use.
Also, in GTs, sprinters have to get over the mountains too.
Might even be more incentive, since they have to make the time cuts.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Yep
And more oxygen carrying capacity is not a bad thing in the sprints either.
I wouldn’t consider the sprinters any more or less inclined to use doping than anyone else. Depends on the individual rider and the team environments he has experienced.
Also, according to Puerto document #23
Allan Davis’s regime included EPO, along with growth hormone and IGF-1 (Insulin-like growth factor 1).
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
No, but to save tracking down the same links I keep a "Puerto shit" file.
Handy-dandy reference material.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
This was the motive of my original question...
I couldn’t think of any being caught, then started wondering why.
also the asthmatic commuter's friend
two puffs does juice your legs, yet it’s the standard dose. Hard call.
Koos Moerenhout on Twitter
Read the news of TD. Painfull for him and bad for cycling! Somehow bad news always comes out just before a Tour start!1 minute ago from web
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
aaaah yes.
The bad news/TdF -conspiracy. Now there’s the standard rider-response we have all come to know and love.
Exactly my thoughts!
You never can quite tell whether they’re upset that someone got caught, or that it was being done.
Not just the riders
their wives too:
ChiaraPasserini : quite unfair though that they give Dekker’s news the day that all of the teams go to Monaco…it’s always like this.
Kohl Connection
According to the reporting on the Kohl case, the Austrian police had the names of a number of riders who visited the same apartment as Kohl did. Kohl also provided the names he knew and has admitted to dealing, including nameing names. Kohl told the authorities exactly what he used.
Presumable, WADA now has all this information. I suspect, though don’t know, that the evidence provided by Kohl and uncovered by the Austrian police – not the bio-passport – are how Dekker got caught out.
This raises the question as to who else Kohl named, and who else may be subject to similar testing.
Think you're right.
Certainly would explain the timing (as well as the usual pre-tour silly season). Plus the Kohl/others/Vienna/Dekker connection, as Jens pointed out, has come up too many times to ignore.
The UCI statement, though, does seem to be tying it to the passport. “Biological passport” is the heading for the press release, & the case against him is based on his blood profile in 2008 and 2009, as well as this retest. It is funny though: they must have thought they needed the further evidence of the positive test to prosecute the case, otherwise why wasn’t he named with the five the other week? Or maybe, given that until now (May, the UCI statement says) WADA wouldn’t recognise a positive for Dynepo, to prosecute a well-founded case using both bits of elements reinforcing each other was, shall we say, opportune? So Kohl may well have confirmed stuff they pretty much already knew? Would guess he’s in there somewhere though.
+1
They’re heavily emphasizing that this is the result of newer, better methods of testing for Dynepo, which take the old result from non-negative to positive, and BioPassport.
Part of this may be to avoid letting people know exactly what Kohl is telling them, and another part of it may be that they really want to push the line that the BioPassport is effective, but I tend to think that it may also be that this really is a matter of the tests getting better and UCI wanting to crow about that, both for deterrent effect and for public relations spin.
good points
I’ll take: The bio-passport told them what samples to re-test, and Kohl told them what to look for.
No doubt the passport thingy contributed here, because they have known about abnormal levels with Dekker for a while. But the timing leads me to believe that they got more information than the passport alone. That is, they finally knew what to look for.
I’m guessing this case is also designed as a warning: Look Tour riders, we can test for Dynepo now.
The more I think about this:
The more I think that the big development here is “we can test for Dynepo” now.
in the "it could be worse" dept.
Just saw espn.com reporting that suspended NASCAR driver Jeremy Mayfield tested positive for Meth.
. . .
i know you'll think this is crazy, but
wonder if he likes to party or if this is a performance enhancing drug case? meth was distributed in vietnam as a stimulant to keep soldiers amped and alert on long, arduous sorties. how many laps on the hot asphalt do you have to drive to survive a nascar event? ummm nevermind…. back to bike racing!
"Race radios in Cat 4?"
He was five years old when the war ended
I hope he’ll come up with a better excuse
And it's used at both a work-enhancing and party drug in the Philippines and Thailand.
Yabaa or Shabu. Huge social problem, and also the reason that sudafed is a controlled drug (which sucks for diver travel.)
For some reason
I saw that and read “tested positive for meh.” Whoa, you can test for that?
Your power is turning our darkness to dawn,
Roll on Columbia, Roll on!
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 1, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Did I mention
DIT IS EEN DRAMA!
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Fast cars, fancy clothes
pretty boy Dekker, did you
ever love the race?
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
Well, yeah
What does seem to come through from every interview is his basic love for the bike. In that Dutch interview I linked (http://www.denbraber.nl/?content=detail&id=106) he repeats: yes I like expensive clothes and fast cars, but they may take away all my possessions if it leaves me with a nice palmares at the end of my career. Also, after the question if he ever thought about quitting: never, I would miss the cycling world like I would miss a toothache but I would dearly miss cycling.
Don't go stomping on my haiku with your pesky quotes.
I have a little friend, you know.
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
"Thomas is shocked"
First response, via his lawyer, says there will be a statement tomorrow. Translated story here: http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=n&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sportweek.nl%2Fwielrennen%2F101714%2FAdvocaat_van_Dekker_Thomas_is_geschokt&sl=nl&tl=en&history_state0=
I can't understand why people cheat--Mark Cavendish
For the Dutch readers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4juy1KEXtDg
Thomas Dekker in ‘Dit was het nieuws’
Bah. 1:40.
Question asked,roughly:
Riders are ‘crying’ when they are caught. Have you already prepared yourself for when you get caught?
Clement l'hottelerie tested postive dor a medicine.
He couldn’t hand in an attest(?), Doctor proof. VacansOleil an l’Hottelerie broke up.
Source: telesport.nl
QST dismisses the acquisition(?) made by Sinkewitz. Saying it’s a complot against them. Why has this to happen just before the Tour. Hypocretic.. Don’t say namesin edvdw’s name but c’mon..
That was the dope de journal again for today.
Ooh no. just 1. Reporters said there was going to be a dopingcase out of Monaco today. Maybe it’s the l’hottelerie case.. maybe not..
Rasmussen
Busted for Dynepo too accordig to Dutch newspaper
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Seems to be unsubstantiated rumour though
It’s a louse newspaper anyway
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Sounds like a re-hash of old news
They know there is an old sample that has never been confirmed as a certain positive. They then go on to assume that this will be retested and come up positive with this new analysis-method.
Google translation goodness
The Frenchman rode last year for Skil-Shimano. He conquered the balls for his team jersey in Paris-Nice and did well in the rankings. Subsequently, however, deadlocked in the cooperation between both parties. Lhottellerie applied openly to step up and sent to a fraction. When he twice appeared to agree, the Dutch team had enough of the cyclist. He signed for this year Vacansoleil, but could not really break a lot of pots.
You know that you're on a Dutch team...
…when they use pot as a measure of your performance.
Staring at the swim team gets you killed by a gang of dancing ninja men who know how to twirl.
by TheFigurehead on Jul 2, 2009 4:39 AM EDT up reply actions
after ricco was too good to be true
I had my fingers crossed over l’Hottelerie. But I left him off my VDS team just in case. Too bad if he’s caught. I really liked his style.
Whoa...
WaPo article where our friend Catlin appears:
The product, Ergopharm’s Ergolean AMP, contains an obscure substance that was patented in 1944 and considered for use as an inhalant for nasal decongestion by Eli Lilly and Company. It is known as methylhexaneamine, according to Don Catlin, a noted researcher who analyzed the product and was reimbursed for the work by The Post.
“The chemical structure is similar to amphetamines and ephedrine,” said Catlin, whose Los Angeles laboratory provides drug testing for Olympic sports, minor league baseball, the NFL and NCAA. “In this class of drugs, everything depends on the dose. Take enough of it and your heart rate and blood pressure will go up and you can die.”
[…]
Stimulants have been abused by athletes for decades and were considered mainstays in Major League Baseball clubhouses, many players have said publicly, before baseball began a drug testing program in 2004. Because methylhexaneamine would not show up in standard drug screens — though that will quickly change as soon as Catlin’s discovery is publicized — it could offer athletes in sports that test for stimulants such as ephedrine and amphetamines an alternative that would not produce a positive test.
[…]
Besides the Chinese research paper, The Post could find no other modern research on methylhexaneamine. It was studied in the 1940s and 1950s. Catlin could not find any research indicating oral administration in humans. It is unclear whether the substance is toxic, addictive or has other harmful side effects. The 1944 patent states that methylhexaneamine has fewer side effects than amphetamines and ephedrine, but the FDA has not evaluated it.
“This stuff ought not be out there,” Catlin said. “It’s dangerous material.”
Staring at the swim team gets you killed by a gang of dancing ninja men who know how to twirl.
by TheFigurehead on Jul 2, 2009 5:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Ja, don't buy the
“it was in a natural herbmedicine”-crap that is bound to come from L’Hottellerie.
It took 3 minutes of googling to end up on the most goulish steroid-forums………..
Rabo's team doctor resigned
Unhappy with the current team policy apparently. Link here.
No idea if this is linked to the Dekker story but it might well be.
"Where there’s a will, there’s a way.": Alberto Contador, shortly after waking up from brain surgery.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
Featured Stories
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
![This is funny on so many levels. [Html should open bigger]](http://cdn3.sbnation.com/fan_shot_images/239959/flagged_small.jpg)
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
