VN: LeMond free to irritate Armstrong
Is this LeMond/Armstrong/Andreau/Trek/VO2Max/Testa thing fixin' to get weird?
about 1 month ago
itswells
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Please no make it stop. Please?
Every time LeMond opens his mouth, I get embarrassed for him. And I am tired of that, if nothing else.
by Sui Juris on Feb 5, 2010 9:41 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
bah lawyers
(present company excepted) :)
Moo
by Willj on Feb 5, 2010 11:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm tired of Armstrong
Guess we’ll both just have to deal with it…
by Fernando on Feb 5, 2010 10:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
which just, in my view
goes on to show how bad it is, that I want LeMond to just give it a rest. I mean, I love a good kicking of Armstrong (whom I think is guilty of pretty much everything he’s been accused of, except bad taste in women). So you’d think I’d be behind LeMond, but too many times the words, when they come from him, end up sounding like a whole lot of whining.
by Sui Juris on Feb 5, 2010 5:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Has anyone actually accused LA of bad taste in women?
Agreed on the rest of this, pretty much completely.
(On a side note: I read the settlement as someone’s lawyers telling Trek, or maybe Trek’s marketing people telling Trek, that the damage that comes from a trial is exponentially worse than anything Greg says anywhere for the next decade or more in the absence of a legal framework that compels the answering of questions or the taking of the fifth.)
by Ed K on Feb 5, 2010 11:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He has been accused of liking women who look alike.
by profgubler on Feb 5, 2010 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
HIs mom is kind of hot
Wait, were talking about Drew, right?
by Jimbo... on Feb 6, 2010 12:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Drew is Lance's mom?
Learn something everyday here at the Podium cafe.
by ursula on Feb 6, 2010 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
some people don't like clowns...
…others don’t like wild animals in captivity made to do tricks, but the circus is always popular!
"Ants don’t worry, they operate like a fantastic team, they accept obstacles and deal with them in a positive manner, they don’t complain and remain positive. An ant doesn’t work on emotion, is proactive and always chooses the ant role."
by ant1 on Feb 5, 2010 11:03 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
We have more bike races in the States
to race in or watch because of those two clowns. If you like cycling, you have to give them their due at least.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 5, 2010 11:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i'll give them their due as cyclists
but they’re still a couple of clowns. (initial comment was not meant to be taken entirely seriously)
by yeehoo on Feb 6, 2010 4:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The way I see things (from my biased pro-Lemond point of view, lol)
Is that Greg leveled a fair criticism at Armstrong in 2001. This Italian doctor was a bozo. Armstrong threw a hissy fit that his heroic/good guy persona took a beating in the media and ever since he’s tried to undermine Greg’s credibility as a voice against doping.
by Fernando on Feb 5, 2010 1:18 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Thank goodness they settled
No one was going to come out of that fight looking better.
Cycling will always be a beautiful sport no matter how many people disgrace it.--Christian Vande Velde
by tgartner on Feb 5, 2010 3:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Can't help
poking VN here. Why do they think we want to read this?
"The only pain I got time for is the pain I put on fools who don't know what time it is." Edvald Boasson Hagen
by Chris... on Feb 5, 2010 8:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
because . . .
they’re really, REALLY tired of having to write stories about Armstrong, and want to make sure that they never have to again.
by R Mc on Feb 5, 2010 8:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Greg Lemond is
so completely jealous of Armstrong it’s pathetic. What has Lemond done for anybody except to cause problems. For all of Lance’s dickness he still help thousands of people a day. I have no romantic cycling notions for either they are both great cyclist and I have more reason to believe Lemond dopes than Lance. Anyway Lance took away Greg’s greateast american Cyclist title and he can’t deal with and that’s that.
by Brandontw9 on Feb 6, 2010 12:12 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
oh, see, and then someone had to go and say something stupid like this . . .
by Sui Juris on Feb 6, 2010 12:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm almost feeling like July now....
not good.
by rbjhan on Feb 6, 2010 3:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well, if you get moving now
we’ll all arrive at the same time! :)
by Sui Juris on Feb 6, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How did Lance snatch the title away from Major Taylor?
He who is, is. He who is not, seeks.
by flying dog on Feb 6, 2010 12:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
By
- being alive
- having won 7 consecutive Tours of France.
by tedvdw on Feb 6, 2010 7:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so much to learn, so much to learn :-p
He who is, is. He who is not, seeks.
by flying dog on Feb 6, 2010 8:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A is more important than B...
…for reference: note any survey of the ‘greatest bands, movies, books, etc., of the century, decade, year’ will always be heavily weighted to the recent ones, even if at least half of them are derivative crap.
by Ed K on Feb 6, 2010 11:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Apart from the a sheepish return of a small mountain of stuffed lions,
Lance is doing exactly what he should for bicycling: Making the pro sport more interesting with his return, bringing money to the sport, and then also he does great stuff like having these spontaneous family-friendly critical masses all over the world, so wonderful for bicycling.
But I still support Greg all the way – even as it is clear he is motivated already, and far along on his own path. Greg is similar in some ways to Lance using his fame to help fight cancer, but using his to try and clean up pro bicycling. Nobody else pointed out Contador’s speed in the tour, so at least he provides the template for one way to go forward, even as his science ideas are not proven and accepted by everyone.
The whole sport is in the dumper anyways, and will get worse and even less wealthy before it gets better.
Noting that Lemond always seems to do real okay on the business side of things, and his defunct bike company made many a classic bike. The Poprad. The Zurich. The Victoire. Very nice.
by thisisntthezodiac on Feb 6, 2010 11:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Um, so if Greg has good intentions but goes around making groundless accusations...
…that’s ok, because he means well? Um….
…no.
by Ed K on Feb 6, 2010 11:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pointing out that Armstrong's association with Ferrari
was not groundless.
Even if Lemond’s accusations do turn out to be mistaken, they are not groundless, AND refuting them involves learning more about the level of effort necessary to be successful at the top end of this sport.
That winds up being a net positive because it produces more knowledge about the sport which can be used to create a more-informed appreciation of the sport—beyond hero worship of a select few ’personalities."
As for Contador—finding the initials AC in the Puerto files raises suspicion, does it not?
It’s possible that Contador—Saiz’s star find—was not on anything and was just being monitored.
It’s also possible that Laurent Jalabert never ever once doped.
It’s also possible that the fan expectation that it’s humanly possible to produce those levels of effort on a regular basis without extreme medical support and manipulation is what’s mistaken.
by R Mc on Feb 7, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Creating suspicion around the world's best cyclist
does nothing to improve the image of the sport of cycling.
March 14, 2010: The great one returns!
by Phil H. on Feb 6, 2010 11:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but years later the question has only recently advanced beyond:
“It’s impossible for Lance to pump out those watts, because no human can, and therefore he cheated.”
A silly argument really, Lance and Contador have done these high energy efforts in front of our eyes, yet also not surprising to see this passed on to Contador.
Not claiming anything great about Lemond’s watts and measured as a teenager thing, or whatever,
but you can be sure Greg Lemond did not create suspicion around Contador, all pro cyclists are already under heavy suspicion and with good reason. Tour winners without exception are suspected going back quite a few years.
Greg vs. Lance – Voting Greg, and if he was me, once they start calling your hotel room, I would never back down ever either, and that seems to be happening.
It’s ugly, but what’s the real truth?
by thisisntthezodiac on Feb 6, 2010 11:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
When will they learn? Bashing Lance is only making him stronger..
Vaughters thinks Wiggins has further potential, even if it may not be realised in 2010. "The 2009 Tour route was suited to Brad, but 2010 is less so," he said. "In 2009, the tactics worked in his favour and Astana were soft-pedalling a bit to not embarrass Lance [Armstrong]. And Brad is very good at a flat stage that has a big hill at the finish and we saw a lot of that in 2009."
"Here the high school level of immaturity will be left to hottitude columns and people like myself." Der Phil. H
by Frinking on Feb 7, 2010 5:00 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Never a truer word was spoken!.
"How strange it was to see men doing something beautiful. Something pointless and elegant." Tim Winton, 'Breath'
by Seahorse on Feb 7, 2010 5:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I saw that article too.
Now ‘Lance if free to irratate JV’.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 7, 2010 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You mean he hasn't been irritating JV all these years?
Lance can be very irritating. I think it’s a tool he’s been using for years to get under certain peoples skin.
He who is, is. He who is not, seeks.
by flying dog on Feb 7, 2010 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
JV asked for this one.
LA doesn’t need motivation, either to fire back with words or on the bike.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 7, 2010 12:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In some fairness , it was an offhand remark
made in the context of a raceanalysis that was not at all focused at Lance. Also, Bjarne Riis has made roughly the same analysis in public without getting the evil eye. Of course he doesn’t have the same history with LA as Vaughters does.
by Jens on Feb 7, 2010 12:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder though
It comes off as an offhand remark, but JV doesn’t seem to be someone to make irresponsible comments. I’m pretty sure he knew what he was saying, but it’s not clear what he hoped to accomplish with the statement.
And it also makes no sense. “Astana softpedaling to not embarrass Lance…” Does anyone need a reminder that Lance did finish 3rd, 37 seconds ahead of Wiggins in 4th? If Astana were really softpedaling, I find it hard to believe that Garmin et al, would be content to just roll along at the reduced paced. Was Astana really so dominant that they could slow down the whole peloton?
"Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs."
by jsallee00 on Feb 7, 2010 12:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
With 3 favourites capable to end on the podium
the other teams were certainly leaving the pacemaking up to Astana on many stages. And softpedalling doesn’t necessarily mean “going slowly” in this context, but rather adapting the tempo in different places/times to suit the leader, in this case Armstrong.
Look at the stages where LA ended up in trouble, it’s where the terrain made more aggressive racing possible. 2009 had very little of it, which suited both Wiggo and Armstrong, 2010 however looks very different.
by Jens on Feb 7, 2010 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In that context
In makes more sense, and I have no way of knowing what JV’s intent was. I’m more familiar with the term “soft-pedaling” being used in the context of “easing-up”, which doesn’t make sense to me here, especially when it’s in the same sentence as “embarrass Lance”. But if you can read it as controlling the pace at a steady tempo, than that makes a lot more sense. In which case, you could substitute “Kloden” for “Lance” and the statement would be equally valid, yet far less likely to be seen as contreversial.
"Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs."
by jsallee00 on Feb 7, 2010 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I always tend to think of how aggressively the team
Astana had in 2009, with Bruyneel at the helm, could have ridden with a captain like Contador.
Compared to that, I would describe it as softpedalling too and apart from Lance’s presence the only other explanation for it would be extreme conservatism on JB’s part and I think that would be out of character.
by Jens on Feb 7, 2010 2:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ah
That I completely agree with. It seemed clear that JB was trying to sweep the podium, and having the team ride towards that goal. So right, they weren’t all burying themselves to get AC as big a win as possible, therefore “soft-pedaling”.
And yes, that certainly was helpful to Wiggins, and he won’t be able to count on that in this years tour. All of that makes sense. The part that doesn’t is when he uses “to not embarrass Lance” as the teams motivation. But maybe he just couldn’t resist the urge to throw out an insult.
"Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs."
by jsallee00 on Feb 7, 2010 2:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In response to your whole comment, all I have to say is...
“NOT”
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 7, 2010 8:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, was too - Lance is basically openly coveting Tyler Farrar for Radio Shack
In a bigger sport, it would not even be allowed for Lance as a Shack executive to comment as he has recently, talking up racing the worlds in support of Garmin Rider Tyler Farrar. Lance is basically twirling the concept of an American team at the Worlds around his finger and presenting it as an old boys network opportunity, rather than something that might actually be an honor in itself to ride, or that USA cycling might actually have the power to pick the team, rather than Lance. Or something like that.
Lance took sides in some flap between Garmin and High Road last year, can’t remember, but I think the effort was to cozy up to High Road / Cav for road courtesies in the TDF.
And yes Bjarne too did this last year on behalf of Andy – maybe Vaughters thinks some of his guys will be able to ride away from Lance this year, somewhere, if not in the Alps?
by thisisntthezodiac on Feb 7, 2010 11:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe this will make sense to me in the morning,
after coffee.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 8, 2010 12:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Radio Shack Team is new, but the riders are old.
Who would be the very most desirable rider to Shack up with? :-)
by thisisntthezodiac on Feb 8, 2010 12:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Without young talent, the Shack will dry up.
Farrar is the best possible guy for them.
by thisisntthezodiac on Feb 8, 2010 12:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe
But those guys have a monomania for finding the next great American g.c. hope . . .
by R Mc on Feb 8, 2010 11:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Generally I'd agree
but if they have some fantasy about RS sticking around post-Lance a prolific US winner helps. Plus it would have the added benefit of pissing JV off, but they get that just from floating the rumor.
by Jens on Feb 8, 2010 11:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I dont really see LA as giving too much thought to much of what JV says these days.
Outside of one ride up Mt. Ventoux, I doubt Lance covets much of what JV has achieved either. I like and respect Vaughters, don’t get me wrong, but I feel you guys are giving him a lot of credit in assuming Lance takes stock in JVs comments. Afterall, its tough to hear whats being said on the ground, when you exist in the head-inflating decrease in atmospheric pressure associated witht the stratosphere.
"He looked pretty good until he went over the side of that cliff." PdC's own thevaro, on why he's betting on Oscar Periero's "BIG COMEBACK" in 2010
by Koppenberg34 on Feb 8, 2010 5:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
+1
It obviously bothered Lance and his twitteratti quite a bit.
by PopUp Rolen on Feb 8, 2010 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, corrected I stand...
I should know better than to sell Lance short when it comes to getting petty.
"He looked pretty good until he went over the side of that cliff." PdC's own thevaro, on why he's betting on Oscar Periero's "BIG COMEBACK" in 2010
by Koppenberg34 on Feb 8, 2010 9:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I love... "his twitteratti"
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
by sminer on Feb 8, 2010 7:01 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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