PT licenses to redistribute to...
Astana, Euskaltel, Velocity (MRM), Francaise Des Jeux, Geox, Liquigas, HTC-Colombia, Movistar (GCE), Bougyues Telecom, BMC, Cofidis, Pegasus (VAU)(Fly V Australia), Lux team and VacancSoleil go for 8 PT licenses in 2011.
Other PT licensesin 2011 are for:
AG2R-La Mondiale, Garmin-Transistions, Lampre, Omega, Quick-Step, Rabobank, Sky, Katushya, RadioShack and SaxoBank .
almost 2 years ago
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14 teams for 8 positions.
And 5 of them almost 100% shoo in. So it is 9 for 3 positions. Oh Oh!
ASTANA - 4 - EVAH! Is classier than SUNGARD- WHATEVAH!
.
My guess:
Astana
Euskaltel
Geox
Liquigas
HTC-Colombia
Movistar (GCE),
Lux team
Francaise Des Jeux
With FdJ the most likely to lose out, and Lux depending on who they sign besides the Schlecks maybe.
Euskaltel doesn't really need a PT license do they?
But seems solid. Geox not so sure.. What do they have to offer qua quality? And FdJ could also be VacansOleil
Footon + a lot of cash = I don't think Sastre will their only big signing.
FdJ could be Vacansoleil, but imho FdJ hasn’t really done bad enough to have their license taken away and Vacan hasn’t really done good enough to demand a spot (partly because they never got to ride anywhere, but I don’t think UCI will see it that way). Also, they haven’t managed to sign any absolute world stars yet.
In terms of marketing and image and PR and all that?
No.
I just mean he can’t carry a team to a PT license on his own, which isn’t a shame really because I don’t think many people can. Lance, surely. Cavendish, Contador and Cancellara, probably.
I'm exhausted
So my kid-o-meter isn’t working properly.
The Schlecks may be able to pull off a PT license by themselves, by the way.
If you always assume Jens is being a jackass
you’ll never go wrong.
Phone’s ringing, Dude…….
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
not to mention wrong
We all know why Devolder won.
"Good thing I never said out loud that I was pulling for France, before this all started." -Mark Blacknell
by Chris Fontecchio on Aug 16, 2010 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Chipotle?
Garmin Chipotle again? What happened to Transitions?
Chipotle>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>transitions
"Until you shoot me off my bike I'll keep looking for a contract" - Jens!
Quitter's People United member # 42
I'm hungry for a fajita burrito - too bad chipotle is all the way in West Hartford...
Yes, I will have an Ultra Liberal MoCo Latte please.
by JustJoshinYa on Aug 16, 2010 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Mmmmmm. Burritos
The good news is that the continent where you live has Chipotle. Mine is in tied with Antarctica in barbacoa availability.
by Mr 60 Percent on Aug 16, 2010 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Isn't there a fantastic hot dog place in Hartford?
That I saw featured on Man vs Food?
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
saw something on google about it, but haven't heard of it personally...
travelchannel website says:
Doogie’s
Adam has Doogie’s 2-foot Works Dog, topped with every topping in the place.
Not sure my stomach can deal with a 2 foot long hot dog…
Yes, I will have an Ultra Liberal MoCo Latte please.
by JustJoshinYa on Aug 16, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
crap - he did two...
Woody’s
Adam tries Woody’s loaded hot dogs like the Deputy Dog, a foot-long topped with pulled pork, melted cheddar cheese and BBQ sauce.
Yes, I will have an Ultra Liberal MoCo Latte please.
by JustJoshinYa on Aug 16, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
That;s the one.
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
sounds like it may be the reason all by itself that coronary artery disease exists...
Yes, I will have an Ultra Liberal MoCo Latte please.
by JustJoshinYa on Aug 17, 2010 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Why do you hate CAD?
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
Obviously a man who didn't watch the Tour
or who skipped the ad breaks at least.
I'll go:
Astana, Euskaltel, Liquigas, HTC, Movistar, Vacansoleil, [Schleck team], BMC. So Cervélo aren’t interested?
My guess: money-issue
As good publicity as it is I doubt they can get the really big budget together just with manufacturers. No big signings etc.. I think they are adapting the ambitions to the given financial limitations?
My guess: money-issue
As good publicity as it is I doubt they can get the really big budget together just with manufacturers. No big signings etc.. I think they are adapting the ambitions to the given financial limitations?
Double posting again Dude......
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
Do we know anything solid about the 18 point plan?
"Oh man, it’s going to take days to kill all these people!"
Just the rumours -
18 points to spend, GT is 9 points, the big classics are 6. At the beginning of summer BMC had already spent 54 points I think someone calculated.
Velocity? When did that ever happen?
"Until you shoot me off my bike I'll keep looking for a contract" - Jens!
Quitter's People United member # 42
Probably the name of the licence-holding company, not a sponsor?
van Gerwen keeps insisting he might find new backing.
I'm just surprised they are applying for a license
when they seemingly don’t have a team or any riders for next year.
"Until you shoot me off my bike I'll keep looking for a contract" - Jens!
Quitter's People United member # 42
Application might have been turned in long ago?
It sends a signal that they are confident and besides it would be a bummer if they didn’t apply and then found a sponsor but had no chance of a PT licence.
My guess
Astana: Yes, quality roster and apparently doing OK now financially
Euskatel: No, outside of SamSan and Anton they don’t have a ton and I don’t feel they should even apply for a license. Getting into the Tour with Sammu should still be doable and otherwise they only focus on Spain anyway.
Velocity: Wut?
FdJ: No, get into Tour with WC
Geox: Even with Sastre they shouldn’t, pretty much Fuji + an old and likely finished GC guy.
Leaky: Well…duh…yes
HTC: Well…duh…yes
Movistar: They seem to keep all the CdE guys so definitely PT levelteam
Bweeg, BMC, Cofidis: Should continue to be Pro-Conti as they have had greater success there this year than they did at PT and they still get into the big races.
Pegawut: No way they are ready to jump that high
Lux and Vac: Yes, Vac will get some more big names and both have the loot.
So I see 6 as locks with two of the others to join, maybe one French team and Eusky or BMC.
"Until you shoot me off my bike I'll keep looking for a contract" - Jens!
Quitter's People United member # 42
VacanSoleil
They’ve spent a lot on sponsoring races, Isn’t that like being the life blood of the sport. I fully expect the UCI to not give them a license and then wonder out loud why they pulled out of bicycle racing altogether a few years down the road.
What you're saying is
that bribes ought to work?
Badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger...
by TheFigurehead on Aug 16, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions
The pro tour for next year should be
With AG2R, Garmin, Lampre, Lotto, Radio Shack, Quickstep, Katusha, Sky, rabobank already in the fold
1. HTC: Obvious choice, a top tier team, capable of winning many races
2. Liquigas: Have a great mix of veteran and young talent, belong in all top races
3. Astana: had a great season, still are going to keep some good riders (Vino, Iglinsky, gaspa) and are looking at others (Kreuziger, Kiserlovski)
4. Team Schleck: if all the paper work is squared away, they will be competitive and already have a solid looking roster from speculation.
5. Movistar: Will keep most of their roster, have strong backing and history of results.
6. Vacansoleil: Still have Leukemans, bringing in Devolder and maybe others. This is a strong team, strong enough to be counted among the Pro Tour at least
7. FDJ: They’ve been with the PT since the get go, and they’ll have to accept at least one more French team, might as well be the one with the current PT license
8. Geox: Sastre’s addition legitimizes them, the cunego rumors showed they were serious about beefing up a roster that has plenty of talent as is. i say they should get another license.
Teams missing the mark
9. BMC: Nice roster, iffy results, and the Frei and Ballan/Santambrogio business is worrisome. they have a little bit more to prove
10. Bbox: A good tour doesn’t make them PT level, they stepped back last year and i guess they’ll stay where they are
11. Euskaltel: have not shown great commitment to some parts of the HC/PT, with such competition, it’s a Pro Conti license for them.
12. Cofidis: Not as commited either, and had a below average roster
13. Fly V: I applaud their effort, but they’ll have to make the jump one step at a time. it’s for the best
14. Velocity?: Are they even gonna be around? It seems like riders re bailing and no sponsor nes either. Underperforming with a full roster, bottom end pro conti if they lose their top half dozen riders.
"You know if there's any contact at all Cristiano Ronaldo's gonna go down...maybe even just a puff of wind"
A 36-year old guy aging GC guy
turns the 29th place team in the UCI standings into the 27th place team. And worse if some of the continentals could get into races. Can’t take Geox.
BMC and Euskaltel is that they don’t need a PT license to race where they want. I think BMC will get a license anyway, but probably not Euskaltel. The teams who badly need a license who have a snowball’s chance are Vacansoleil, BBox, FDJ and Cofidis — I would rank them in that order. By my math, two get in.
by Mr 60 Percent on Aug 16, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions
We don't who else they have signed
if the suggested budget numbers are anywhere near true there are bound to be more names in the pipe.
I'm under the impression
that Geox will have the funding to put together a much better team. i think it might be PT worthy, but this is really too early to make concrete speculations. It’s just my expectation that they will put together a team that will be PT level. Also they like FDJ have been with the pro tour for its entirety, and I believe that will play a factor.
"You know if there's any contact at all Cristiano Ronaldo's gonna go down...maybe even just a puff of wind"
I do too actually
but, for whatever reason Bbox is Pro Continental, and I can’t see any reason why they switch places with FDJ this year. i do not think the UCI is going to radically change the complexion, and that move is somewhat radical.
"You know if there's any contact at all Cristiano Ronaldo's gonna go down...maybe even just a puff of wind"
Under the 2011 "automatic invites agreement"
(ASO/RCS/Unipublic have guaranteed invites to top 17 teams in the rankings at year end – which is a lot of races) some teams might not “need” pro tour status, and others could be very reliant on it to get in races.
Current rankings
1 ASTANA (AST) KAZ 976
2 TEAM SAXO BANK (SAX) DEN 790
3 TEAM KATUSHA (KAT) RUS 739
4 RABOBANK (RAB) NED 695
5 LIQUIGAS-DOIMO (LIQ) ITA 667
6 TEAM HTC – COLUMBIA (THR) USA 657
7 BMC RACING TEAM (BMC) USA 633
8 OMEGA PHARMA-LOTTO (OLO) BEL 621
9 CAISSE D’EPARGNE (GCE) ESP 586
10 GARMIN – TRANSITIONS (GRM) USA 586
11 TEAM RADIOSHACK (RSH) USA 573
12 LAMPRE-FARNESE VINI (LAM) ITA 506
13 CERVELO TEST TEAM (CTT) SUI 464
14 EUSKALTEL – EUSKADI (EUS) ESP 428
15 QUICK STEP (QST) BEL 312
16 SKY PROFESSIONAL CYCLING TEAM (SKY) GBR 291
17 ANDRONI GIOCATTOLI – SERRAMENTI PVC DIQUIGIOVANNI (AND) ITA 243
18 AG2R LA MONDIALE (ALM) FRA 198
19 COFIDIS, LE CREDIT EN LIGNE (COF) FRA 148
20 BBOX BOUYGUES TELECOM (BTL) FRA 147
21 ACQUA & SAPONE – D’ANGELO & ANTENUCCI (ASA) ITA 134
22 VACANSOLEIL PRO CYCLING TEAM (VAC) NED 123
23 COLNAGO – CSF INOX (COG) IRL 119
24 TEAM MILRAM (MRM) GER 108
25 FRANÇAISE DES JEUX (FDJ) FRA 96
26 SAUR – SOJASUN (SAU) FRA 63
27 TOPSPORT VLAANDEREN – MERCATOR (TSV) BEL 60
28 LANDBOUWKREDIET (LAN) BEL 40
29 FOOTON-SERVETTO (FOT) ESP 37
30 SKIL – SHIMANO (SKS) NED 2
Top 17 thing - yep
+1
I remember that too. It’s one of the things that makes this transfer season more meaningful. And the guys who hold out become more and more valuable if they have points.
Damn you for costing me sleep
The only source I can find is this and from that you have to assume no, they simply take the teamrankings from the end of this year. When evaluating ProTour licences it is the opposite. The sporting quality is decided by UCI points of the riders contracted for the coming year.
I can only think the goal of the UCI in the deal was to assure that the inclusion criteria was as close as possible to the list of 18 PT teams. I can imagine the UCI demanded entry for 18 PT teams, ASO/RCS wanted fewer pre-qualified teams and 17 was the compromise number?
Well, now that sporting criteria has been proven as a way to get kicked out of the ProTour, maybe the top 17 teams and the ProTour will become synonymous
"Oh man, it’s going to take days to kill all these people!"
Nah
there will always be a lagging in the system. Not all licences are renewed at the same time. Also sporting criteria is only one of the criteria (administration, ethics and finances the other).
I should have said "become more synonymous"
Although that may not be a proper use of synonymous.
You’re right, there will be lag in the system and the best Pro Conti will probably be better than the worst ProTour team.
But the more egregious examples are going to start falling out with time. Especially with the number of teams competing for ProTour slots.
"Oh man, it’s going to take days to kill all these people!"
whoa
That’s silly crazy.
So, who volunteers to do the running spready of the team’s changed rankings as the transfers roll through? (ducks and runs)
I vote Ursula
Second?
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
Drew volunteered
said it was something he always wanted to do.
It makes sense though. You wouldn’t want to judge a future license based on past performance, half the team could have left .
Think about what you're saying for a second.
Do you really want me in charge of this? Also, shouldn’t you be asleep, or at least making marzipan?
"To a New Yorker like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Tigers."
Marzipan? WTF
And yes I should be asleep but ursula taunted me into reading UCI documents and now I’m too scared and confused to sleep.
Go look at the Ed League standings in the smack thread.
I guarantee, you’ll go back to bed until at least the Vuelta.
I really do not understand the truth.--Riccardo Ricco (per Google Translate)
Aah - a fifteen minute breakfast challenge ...
Very roughly would look like
SAX 867
OLO 824
KAT 816
LAM 750
HTC 724
AST 720
BMC 665
GAR 642
CSE 606
RSH 588
LIQ 573
RAB 552
LUX 530
CTT 368
EUS 351
QST 335
SKY 318
ALM 213
BTL 163
FOO 156
COF 148
ASA 134
VAC 123
MRM 121
COL 119
FDJ 103
SAU 63
TSV 60
AND 40
LAN 40
SKS 3
Retired – 89
Going – But Where? – 295
Notes – UCI counts top five riders per team – I’ve counted all riders, so does distort it a little bit.
Benat I and Menchov = Going but where riders
Takes account of most of V90’s spreadsheet – certainly all the bigger points scorers. 20 scoring riders moved teams so far.
by andrewp on Aug 18, 2010 3:55 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'd say to the contrary, but don't knoiw for sure
Set up of current rules has enforced most of the proposed changes already – eligibility is for the teams covered by the agreement done in 08 (the rule that kept milram and footon at the races this year) + the top 17 in the 09 ranking. Assume this will be changed by only changing the year in the text and the agreement will have lapsed. It all seems based on the final scoreboard at season end 2010 – they award prizes and then start again.
The only rule that mentions riders points specifically is
A rider who, in the course of the year, ceases to be a member of a team which has taken part in one or more events on the world calendar during the year in question, shall be withdrawn from the individual ranking.
Or – if you leave your team early = no points. Seems to back up the presumption towards no.
Here – rule 2.1.005 (pg 2) and pg 54+
this makes me want to go back to Chris's ranking comparison post...
…and remind myself how narrow the UCI rankings really are, and how badly the deck is stacked against any teams that aren’t already protour.
Does that look like almost every single wild card to the Tour will go to a French team?
AG2R, Cofidis. BBox and FdJ all fall outside the automatic invite category. 17 automatic invites plus those 4 makes 21, so that’s possible just the one other wild card open.
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