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Top Trumps 9: Advance Australians Fair!

Ah, the Australians!  I always have this stereotype of them as the types of cyclists who ride hard, push things to the limit, and then come back and entertain us by blogging about any mistakes they've made, describing all the traumas with a laugh.  They're such a strong cycling nation, on the road and on the track - and huge credit to Cycling Australia and the Australian Institute of Sport for helping to discover and develop the talent - and for funding and supporting the Australian National Team through the European season.  I don't know if they have Top Trumps in Australia, and I've featured a few of the Aussies elsewhere in my series, but here are some of the other riders I hope we'll be seeing in the green and gold going for the home win in the Worlds next month.  I could have started anywhere but I'm doing this one in order of age.  Let us all rejoice, they're young and free, of beauty rich and rare, toiling with their hearts and hands (and legs) - advance Australians fair!

After hanging out on Podium Café for, oooh, ten minutes, you realise there are certain riders who need to be adopted as Café favourites.  If their favourite beer is Leffe, and their cycling hero is Jens Voigt, for example...  So I hereby nominate Chloe Hosking to be added to the pantheon - read on and find out more.

Chloe_medium
Chloe's only 19, the youngest rider on HTC-Columbia.  She started out on the track, first of all as a sprinter (as a potential junior Anna Meares) before moving up to the endurance events and onto the road. She was taught by her dad to sprint on the roads the Australian way

The track will always give you those skills and my dad is a road sprinter as well, so when I was little he would take me down to the lake and we'd have skills sessions and that type of thing. I've always been encouraged to throw some elbows and the odd headbutt.


before taking time off to focus on her final year of school.  Her plan for 2009 was to have a year's cycling in the USA before going back home to university, but she couldn't find a team to take her on.  Luckily for her, someone put her in touch with Dutch cyclist Martine Bras, who took Chloe under her wing and set her up with Moving Ladies, a Dutch club who get invites to some of the big day races.  She raced and won the Tour of ChongMing Island in April with Australian team MB Cycles, winning 2 of the 4 stages, before starting at Moving Ladies with a 4th place in the GP Stad Roeselare and 6th at the Omloop Van Borsele in the same weekend, followed by podium places in Dutch sprinty day races (the most prestigious being her 2nd place at the Therme Kesseienomloop) and 3rd place on stage 2 at the RaboSter.  The Australian National Team liked what they saw, and took her to the biggest race of the year, the Giro Donne, and to the Tour Féminin Limousin, where she came 2nd in stage 2.  All this brought her to the attention of HTC, who offered her a role as a stagiaire for September, and then a year's contract.... You can read her take on her first Euro season here - and it's thanks to Martine, and those American teams that turned her down!

She rides on the sprint side of HTC, preferring her races flat, technical and aggressive, and combines her racing with studying for a degree in media/communication by correspondence.  My only complaint is that this doesn't give her time to blog more - I especially liked her description of HTC training camp, and think we need more like this:

You’ve got the Germans (Ina, Judith, Luise, along with our Sports Director, Ronny) to set the schedule, the Dutchies (Ellen and Adrie) to break the schedule, and the neutral countries (Sweden, Emilia; New Zealand, Linda; Australia, Me) to do whatever we’re told. Then there are the Americans (Evelyn and Kim) to joke about the Germans setting the schedule, the Dutch breaking the schedule, and the neutrals following the schedule. Finally there’s the Italian (Noemi) who just wants to ride Randa (a climb in Mallorca).

All this at just 19... read on below for the Aussies she's followed onto the European scene - and knowing that most of you know a lot more about the Australian riders (and riders in general) than I do, add anything I've missed (or misinterpreted) into the comments - the more, the merrier!

Star-divide

Our next Australian is the newest rider in the pro peloton, although you'd never guess that from her results.  It's always surprising to be reminded how young Tiffany Cromwell still is - and the fact she's only been in Europe as part of Team Australia. 

Tiffany_card_mediumShe comes from a sporting background and was a super-sporty child, competing at basketball, athletics, triathlon & taekwondo and more, before she was spotted by AIS when they came to her school on a talent-scouting expedition when she was 14.  In 2005 she was part of Team Australia at the Junior Worlds, and then in 2007 she signed to Colavita, riding the USA domestic circuit for two and a half years, winning the Sea Otter Classic in '08 and '09, with forays into Europe with Team Aus, where she came 4th in the Holland Hills Classic in 2008 and in 2009 winning both the ITT stage in the Route de France and the stage 3 bunch sprint at the Tour Féminin en Limousin.  When she signed to Skyter for 2010, alongside stars Nicole Cooke, Amber Neben and Trixi Worrack, it looked like the only way was up.... but then, as we know, Skyter pulled out of the team at the last minute, leaving it too late for the non-German riders to find teams.  Like Nicole and Amber, Tiffany was saved by her national team, and she's been doing well with them all year, with top 20 finishes in some tough races.  

She rode the Australian season with the Honda Dream Team, which started in December 2009, headed up and managed by Lotto Ladies' Team Australian sprint star, Rochelle Gilmore, who also manages Lotto.  Lotto has some excellent and innovative arrangements with Honda in Australia and Biogen Toyota in South Africa, giving riders like one-woman cycling media Ashleigh Moolman the chance to ride in Europe - and Tiffany is the latest Aussie to cross over, signing for Lotto in August.  Her first race for the new team was the Sparkassen Giro, where she came second behind HTC sprinter Ellen Van Dijk

She's as successful off the bike as on, combining riding the two summer seasons with her other job as a freelance fashion designer.  She's designed the team kit for Lotto in 2009 and 2010, and for the Honda dream team, amongst other things, and she has two lines of cycling wear (available from her website and in real life from Australian cycling shops).  She's qualified as a fashion designer and stylist, and one of her long-term aims is to have her own fashion line as well as the sportswear.  Sadly her new team colours at Lotto don't give much scope for really exciting matching nail art, but I'm hoping she's selected for the national team, so she can give us some green and gold glory (Tiffany, if you ever read this, you'd have a website full of fans forever if you'd one day dedicate your nails to the Podium Café!)

What else?  Her website says she speaks Catalan, French, Italian and German, and she seems like a fan of adrenaline, relaxing with rock-climbing and motor-sports....  She's definitely one to watch as a GC contender in the future - and although it was a little bit delayed, it's great to have her finally riding as a pro - long may it last!

Carla_card_medium

Long may it also last for Carla Ryan, though for different reasons.  I'm hoping all the Cervélo riders are safe and secure as the team transfers to Garmin-Cervélo, but we'll have to wait and see.  Carla's been a real team player, supporting Claudia Häusler to her 2nd place in last year's Emakumeen Bira and to her win in the Giro Donne - and this despite crashing hard in the early-season Ronde van Gelderland, effectively delaying her season start until June.   She's only been a pro for 2 years, but as well as playing super-domestique, she has some great results in her own right - coming 2nd in last year's Giro del Trentino behind World and Olympic Champion Nicole Cooke and 8th in the Giro Donne.

She's a key part of Cervélo's all-conquering Team Time Trial squad, and the ITT is a bit of a speciality - she was the Australian National ITT Champion for three years in a row, doubling it with Road Race Champion in 2009 (she missed the 2010 championships to go to the team training camp).  I'm hoping she'll be picked to ride it in the Worlds, with the home advantage....

One more reason to like her is the fact she occasionally blogs on the Cervélo site (I hope the teams keeps that up when they go Garvélo - in fact I hope they increase it, and start twittering about the women's team too) where she makes the cycling life sound like a lot of fun.  It seems like she's solar-powered, loving the fact she goes from summer to summer (maybe it's the freckles acting as solar batteries) and generally coming across as sunny-natured as well.  Keep your fingers crossed that things turn out well for her.

Rachel_card_medium

Another Aussie who needs your good thoughts right now is Rachel Neylan, who's currently recovering from a fractured jaw after crashing earlier this month while out training with Team Australia.  And this after she's just back from a bad crash in the Emakumeen Bira, where she had a very painful injury that involved lots of stitches in her backside.... so she goes from not being able to sit down to not being able to smile, which is just not fair at all!  At least, as a trained sports physiotherapist, she'll know exactly what she needs to do to recover well...

It was when she was travelling in Europe in 2007 as the physio for the Australian national rowing team that she decided she wanted to be the one competing at the highest levels, rather than being support - so she self-nominated to the AIS talent ID programme and was accepted for cycling.  She'd already competed at national level at athletics and rowed for a while - she just needed to find the right sport to match her ambition.  In 2009 she went out to the USA to ride for Proman (which has since morphed into Peanut Butter & Co TWENTY12) learning to domestique for American track and road star Shelley Olds-Evans, initially for 7 weeks, but she ended up racing in the USA for 4 months.  Reading between the lines, it looks like she then took a risk and flew to Europe to persuade the National Team to take her on for the Sparkassen Giro and the World Cup Nürnberger Altstadt, and found herself guest spots with small teams for the Holland Ladies Tour and the Giro Toscana. 

She's a believer in "the harder you work, the luckier you get" - and she's proved that you can only be in the right place at the right time if you make sure you're putting yourself in the best possible place.  Despite the disruptions from injuries - as well as those two big ones, she also crashed out of the Ronde van Gelderland, and the Ronde van Drenthe - her first European season, riding with Team System Data and Team Australia, has been strong - finishing 13th in the first round of the World Cup, the Trofeo Alfredo Binda, 10th in World Cup warm-up race Durango-Durango and 6th in the GP Mameranus, and coming 9th overall in the Tour Féminin en Limousin.  As well as blogging on her website, Rachel can be found blogging and writing all over the place - and she's one of those riders we love, keeping us up-to-date with news and her adventures through her twitter - where you can send her get-well-soon messages.  Here's to her being back smiling and riding very soon, and back on the roads in Europe for 2011.

Another link between Rachel and Carla is that they've both been supported by a sporting scholarship from the Amy Gillet Foundation - Carla in 2007 and Rachel this year.  The  Foundation was set up in memory of Australian cyclist and rower Amy Gillet, who was killed on a training ride in Germany 2005 when a driver lost control of her car and hit Amy and her 5 team-mates.  The Foundation was set up to reduce deaths & injuries caused to cyclists by cars, with national campaigns (including A Metre Matters aimed a drivers and Ride Right aimed at cyclists) and support for research into road safety, and to support women with the same sporting and educational goals Amy had.  It makes me shiver, thinking about the horrible Belgian crash that injured 5 Team GB riders - and of course, the horrific crash that's left Marina Romoli still unable to walk - being reminded how vulnerable the pro cyclists are out there, and the risks all cyclists run every day.  Makes other problems pale in comparison. 

There are ways to help the Foundation - through fundraising and buying merchandise - and if you're lucky enough to be in Australia, joining  their awareness- and fund-raising rides throughout the Australian spring and summer, which 6,400 cyclists took part in last season (the first one of this season is in Adelaide on 7th November).  Rachel recently wrote about how the national team remembered the anniversary of Amy's death and what the scholarship means to her. My thoughts go out to Amy's family and friends, and all those working for Amy's legacy.

Kirsty_card_medium
The final rider in this Top Trumps hand is Rachel's team-mate at Team Systems Data and Team Australia, Kirsty Broun. Kirsty used to combine cycling with working as an Insolvency & Restructuring Lawyer (I'd add jokes about how useful that must be for the women's cycling world, but it's a bit too close to the bone!) but she recently gave it up to ride full time.  She's juggled sporting and professional ambition for years - after starting racing at 16, she stopped a few years later for 6 years to focus on her studies, starting again in the 2007, when she won the first of her two Australian Crit Champion titles.  By 2009 she was winning the overall and 3 stages of the Jayco Bay Cycling Classic & 2 stages of the Canberra Tour and was taken on board by the National Team for 2009, where she came 3rd overall at the Ladies Tour of Qatar and riding in the (now extinct) Tour du Grand Montréal, before heading down to the USA.  She won a stage of the Nature Valley GP and guest-rode for Lipsmacker in June and July alongside Anne Samplonius and Amanda Millar.  She then headed back to Europe with Team Aus where she was beaten to 4th in the World Cup Nürnberger Altstadt by Kirsten Wild, Rochelle Gilmore and Ina-Yoko Teutenberg - and there's no shame in that at all.  She had signed a full-time contract with LipSmacker, but the team folded (see what I mean about the jokes?) so she's back in Europe for 2010, where she's graced the podium after sprint finishes in all kinds of tough races.  She's a fierce competitor, and although she hasn't yet had a big European win, there's still time this season - and I'm sure she'll be back next year...

I could talk about the Australian riders forever, but if you want more, you'll have to add it yourself in the comments.  Aside from these, and the riders mentioned elsewhere in the series, the other riders you might come across in the national colours before the season's out in Europe, and maybe even at Geelong for the Worlds, are former AGF scholarship holders, World Champion rower-turned cyclist Amber Halliday and Limousin stage winner Carlee Taylor, Miffy Galloway, who also blogs and tweets,  Emma Mackie, who you'll be ale to spot at the next National Road Race Champs by the streamers attached to her bike, Shara Gillow and Amanda Spratt - good luck to all of them!  Now, if only Fly V Australia would launch a women's team to ride in Europe alongside their proposed men's Pro-Tour team....  there'd be more than enough talent to fill it!

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Very fun read!

Love these features. I always really enjoy the back stories on the women riders. These are great, keep ’em coming :D

by Jen See on Aug 31, 2010 4:40 PM EDT reply actions  

Also...

The description from Chloe of HTC is freakin’ priceless. Truly awesome.

by Jen See on Aug 31, 2010 4:41 PM EDT reply actions  

aw, thankyou!

And I wish Chloe still blogged – her blog is excellent, really funny

by Sarah Connolly on Aug 31, 2010 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fantastic effort

As someone that has enjoyed and endured racing against these wonderful athletes in Adelaide Grade races I can assure you they ride hard….and party pretty hard too.Their many fans will be out in force in Geelong.

next time....don't forget the gravy!!

by Flatbagger on Aug 31, 2010 5:39 PM EDT reply actions  

I always love the random fact bits :)

And anyone who digs Jens! is a favourite of mine!

by tgsgirl on Aug 31, 2010 6:15 PM EDT reply actions  

I had been wondering what the green & gold stands for....

…but then as a track fan, I realised the gold is for all the medals they lose to the Brits, and the green is for them being green with envy! Hahahaha – or the other way around, of course!

by Sarah Connolly on Aug 31, 2010 6:39 PM EDT reply actions  

haha love it :)

Great piece

"the rest was over 30. And that doesn't mean old and useless, but experienced and with the stamina"

Jens! Voigt, Crit Intl Interview, 2009

by CycleGirl on Aug 31, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rumour has it

that CJ Farquharson has a separate file just for photos of Tiffany’s fingernails!
One rider you missed & is one of the toughest Australian riders around is Tiffany’s close friend & early career Mentor, the gorgeous Alexis Rhodes.
This girl won a Junior World Track title in 2002, she was laying on her death bed in July 2005 after being part of that terrible accident in Germany that claimed the life of Amy Gillett and was able to win the Australian Criterium Title in January 2006. She’s an amazing girl.

by AdelaideFatboy on Sep 1, 2010 5:23 AM EDT reply actions  

Nail Collection and...

Personally, I don’t like CJ site. It’s looks too kiddish, like Sesame st. Sorry, but I feel it’s in need of a serious makeover. The only other thing I dislike about the site is the photos are too small for fans to enjoy and they are plastered with watermarks and Copyrights, a turnoff to fans. Letting the computer decide every time to batch process logos into photos can make some riders look extremely bad. I remember several photos of Amber Neben last year when the logo made her look like one of the three musketeers. At the bottom of every page is the same diatribe pushing people to click and buy her photos. I just think that’s a big turn off to fans and doesn’t help move women’s cycling forward. If you want see what’s absolutely thrilling to fans, then I think CJ should take a cue from British Cycling who posted this absolutely bodacious slideshow without any hideous logos or copyrights, go full screen! Losing the Tour de l’Aude should be felt like a nuclear bomb going off in women’s cycling, and everybody who works in this field should start thinking more about how to save the sport, rather then just to profit from it.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishcycling/sets/72157624252506147/show/

Tiff’s nail collection is here…
http://www.tiffanyjane.com.au/Galleries/MyNailCollection.aspx

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, to be fair

British Cycling isn’t trying to make money from shooting photos. I think it’s perfectly reasonable for working photographers to watermark their work – though certainly I prefer small signatures to huge marks – and to ask for payment in exchange for use.

by Jen See on Sep 1, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I'm sure the fact that she wants to make a living

Is what’s keeping cycling back. Damn photographers trying to earn some money. What, do you think they’re all Annie Leibovitz?

by tgsgirl on Sep 1, 2010 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, given Annie L's recently-avoided bankruptcy,

let’s hope not, eh? ;-)

But really, expecting CJ to be a charitable foundation for the promotion of women’s cycling is just absurd. Though given that she could probably make more money elsewhere, I bet she feels like she is sometimes.

"I was just trying to keep warm" - Ian Stannard on finishing third in KBK

by civetta on Sep 1, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had to google "most famous female photographer" to remember her name, tbh :)

Google gave me Leibowitz and the lady with the creepy baby-in-sunflowers pictures, whose name I have also forgotten.

by tgsgirl on Sep 1, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Plus the reports she writes

(which get used everywhere instead of other places doing their own reporting, without credit) are so useful – how else do we find out about the races?

As Gav says, British Cycling has a different agenda – and is well-funded to carry that out (although not for much longer, seeing the planned Government cuts to all arts & sports funding…)

by Sarah Connolly on Sep 1, 2010 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Photo work

CJ gets paid to work the races by Highroad I believe, and I think UCI paid her before that, although can’t confirm it, been a long time ago now. Did you think she just had pots of money lying around to fly all over the world and work these races? She makes money not only as a paid photographer, but she also sells her photos, so she is getting a much better return then most of the people I know who work the women’s races for free.

Lots of people work in women’s cycling strictly as a charitable donation and I applaud British Cycling for their brilliant work recently since it’s one of the rare instances where I can say I was really touched or moved by a photo shoot. There are too many people running around with a camera trying to shoot photos to make a buck in cycling already.

There is little money to be made selling women’s cycling photos cause I have talked to many of the big guns who do this work and they are not a hot seller like you might think. If someone sincerely wants to move cycling forward for women, then again like I said take a cue from that brilliant slideshow, cause I can’t say I can ever remember seeing anything better. That was classy work from A to Z, without the distraction of click here, buy my photos! It’s wrong to give kudos to people who try to profit off the sport over so many who are doing it on their own dime, those are the real heroes of Women’s cycling.

The best thing on CJ site are the race reports, cause the photos are pretty boring the way it stands.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't get what you're saying

On the one hand you’re saying there’s not much money in selling photos, but on the other, you’re saying she should give them away for free?

I love CJ’s photos very much – I also like the people who do it for free, but tbh they’re not as good quality.

By the way, the slideshow is a feature on flickr – you can make them with any set of photos on flickr – but then (as an avid flickr user) it’s in the T&C that you don’t use flickr for commercial purposes

by Sarah Connolly on Sep 1, 2010 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Quite.

"I was just trying to keep warm" - Ian Stannard on finishing third in KBK

by civetta on Sep 1, 2010 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

photos

There is not much money to be made in photos from women’s cycling. I know guys who worked all the world cup races for years, and to date they have hardly made any money off of it. It’s not even remotely like what goes on with the men’s stuff, Cor Vos or Graham Watson and the like. And clearly the best work I have even seen done over the years was done by several guys who worked all those races, but they never really tried to profit from their photos. They did it because they loved cycling and they spent tons of money out of their own pocket to do it in order to support women’s cycling. I not sure where you are looking, but there is some great photos out there, for free to view, and of very respectable size and quality.

CJ photos are much too small and poor quality to be of much value as entertainment to the public in the sense of putting the best face forward for the women, IMO, especially with those distressing watermarks that often mutate the riders faces. That’s embarrassing to the riders. Her galleries are obviously a seller’s gallery, not a gallery to really put the best light possible on women’s cycling in both size and properly adjusted with post production editing. She basically just throws them up after she brands them with watermarks and copyrights, with the usual spiel at the bottom, seller’s spiel about buy my photos.

Look, you could probably get better results at moving women’s cycling forward if you spent less time dragneting the race scene, and just try to do a really good job in fewer races. I mean with races reports and photos. Spewing out tons of average photos and boring race reports doesn’t help put a good face on the sport. Do fewer races, but write nice well written compelling race reports and post smashing awesome photos in good quality and size, and then watch the traffic flow and people will take notice.

I knew another guy who used to go to tons of races and he shot gazillions of photos, but he spent so much of his time all year long in the field, he never posted half of the photos he shot, and he never had the time to do a good job with post production editing, let along write compelling race reports. The sad part is, if you don’t write stuff down, you forget and lose a lot of details. So just what exactly are you trying to accomplish?

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Look, photographers (& I know a few, & there are a few round here too) make their living where they can.

If HTC send her to a race (& men’s teams often employ a photographer), or the UCI do (which they have), it’s not at all the same as being a salaried member of staff in the way that Larry Hickmott at British Cycling is. She’s still left looking for her next assignment. She owns her work unless she has a contract that says otherwise & that should be respected. That people don’t respect it by & large is why she’s protected her work in the way she has.
 
So, you liked the BC photos. But they were of the British national champs in the leafy lanes of Lancashire. Good though they are, those pics don’t actually convey very much about women’s professional racing to me. BC aren’t sending Larry round Europe photographing Emma or Nicole (in fact, they aren’t sending him abroad any more at all, it seems). It’s an entirely different thing. BC are a national federation reliant on members’ subs & in BC’s case, hefty amounts of public money. Totally irrelevant here.

If women’s cycling is going to be a professional sport, then we need to arrive at a position where it has the capacity to support all the stuff that goes with a professional sport. Which includes CJ’s capacity to make a living, whether by selling her pics or working for a team. The fact that she seems to be able to do so (or to an extent anyway) ought to be welcomed as a good sign. I find it rather baffling that you seem unwilling to do so.

"I was just trying to keep warm" - Ian Stannard on finishing third in KBK

by civetta on Sep 1, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Again...

I not talking about or really care much about who is trying to make a living. I’ve got to eat too, but I am not complaining. That is my problem, it’s your problem, and that’s her problem. It has nothing to do with my replies. I am talking about what will move women’s cycling forward, and I just gave the short answer above. For the record, the best photos I have seen in women’s cycling over the years came from freelancers who did it on their own dime, not the paid professionals. I disagree about the British Photo shoot.

For the typical fans who love women’s cycling, those photos were smashing to say the least. Anytime you can get access like that in front the race and follow it from start to finish is about as good as you can get. I haven’t seen better in a long, long time. Whatever is going on in the UK is besides the point, I am simply saying that was a an awesome photo shoot, and clearly that kind of work will move women’s cycling forward, especially when it posted in that quality, size and detail. They posted at the biggest size, so every monitor on down can resize, brilliant work and quality. There is little doubt, that was bad ass work, pardon my French.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, if that's the short answer...

"I was just trying to keep warm" - Ian Stannard on finishing third in KBK

by civetta on Sep 1, 2010 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

copyrights.

I’m not against copyrighted or watermarked photos. However putting both on photos seems a bit like building a fortress wall around your house. Add to that, if it’s not discreet, and often this is the case, it can wreck photos in the public eye, total disaster.

Nothing is a bigger turnoff to fans. Women’s photos aren’t worth that much, so there is no reason to go overboard with copyrights and watermarks. I’ve been all over the net for years, and rarely have I seen either my own photos or my friends who shoot the races in Europe been stolen, other then willy nilly to post to a forum to chat about or a random post here and there on Facebook. While it’s using them without our permission, and yes, I would of preferred they asked, I am not going to make a big stint over it.

In fact, it’s kind of flattering and I think it helps move women’s cycling forward some. I last thing I want to do is crash the party cause I lost a dollar, which I didn’t anyway. However, this kind of behavior is so rare, ever some very good photos of another guy I have worked with have yet to date been stolen that I know of, not one, and there are no copyrights on those photos either. We don’t batch copyright since it wrecks photos, so we don’t do them all. Putting up a few signs here and there, no trespassing, seems to be work well enough. We don’t believe in being Scrooges or Tyranny when it comes to photos.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, my poor, turned off public eye!

Y’know, there’s this little thing on your mouse that you can click, or not click, if you do, or don’t, want to see a particular image.

How is our enjoyment of those photos something that cries out for you to dump cold water on it? I get that you enjoyed something else more. You’ve posted what you enjoyed more. Fine.

But no matter how many times you tell me which ones I should enjoy more, and why, and how brilliant they are, it’s not going to make me say, “Oh, how stupid I have been all my life, to not realize the inherent vileness of watermarks, and the corresponding brilliance of one set of photos that are the apotheosis of women’s cycling photos, the alpha and omega, the standard that all others should not only strive to attain, but should mimic slavishly.”

You’ve got a standard that makes you feel good, and you’re happy to share. So why the random snark for someone who does it differently, answering their own inner prompts and personal preferences?

And just out of curiosity, do you realize how charmless it is to start a post by explaining why something that someone enjoys is really no good, and is in fact evil and pernicious? And then post a batch of additional posts on your pet peeve, effectively hijacking a thread?

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

If Women's cycling or Women's sport in general is to move forward

I think we would all agree more financial support is needed.
If we could all lobby our respective ministers’ for sport to offer big tax incentives to businesses who support women’s sport.
If Governments were to offer a 150% tax deduction to any business that used a female athlete to advertise their product providing they name the athlete & their sport to prevent them showing a bunch sprint & trying to claim the deduction, then Joe Average would see the Athlete in magazines or television and after a while actually recognise them.
The more they are recognised the more marketable they are.
The fashion industry, cosmetics industry and other female related industries spend squillions of money on advertising.
People are more likely to watch the highlights of a competition on a sports news rather than sit down & watch the entire event, so television coverage will not necessarily bring in the money.
One of the big problems with elite athletes (as wonderful as they are) is that they are almost unemployable. By the time they have done their training they have little or no energy to work and they usually have to travel to compete so any one who employs them are usually very tolerant.
I would imagine that if you ever want to win a movie trivia night, try to get on a table with an elite athlete.
If you did a survey of the womens’ peleton I would think there would be very few who haven’t watched the box set of Sex in the City!
(I think I lost the plot there)

by AdelaideFatboy on Sep 2, 2010 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

AIS

I approve of the AIS model, wish we had a better model here in the states, but we don’t. You moved the discussion into an area so huge, that it would even blow the seams out of the most robust forum. Certainly comments section is not the place for such a topic, but I will make one quick observation.

In Top Trumps Six, one poster made a good point, although there is so much more to this. But the reason women’s cycling is on a merry go round they can’t get off is because it has been marginalized and those at the top of many organizations are making sure it stays that way. Just look at how much money Sky dumped into the men for a clue.

She said she knew a women who was massively talented and genetically gifted, but that she quit and took a regular job because she wasn’t getting paid anything, and she had to foot out of pocket to race. When you marginalize women’s cycling and keep it running on fumes, this is what happens. There is a lot of great talent out there, but the sport can’t grow with great talent because there not even enough money to support the best new talent coming forward. Also lots of women are probably learning to stay clear of this sport cause it sucks bigtime for women right now. Things have got to change, but the issues of change are much too big for this comments section.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 2, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

So taking this to its logical conclusion (and only a little beyond)...

All of the best things in life should be done by volunteers, meaning people who either are independently wealthy, have some other cush job and a sweet hobby, or are content to live on uncooked ramen noodles and live in a tent or on someone’s couch.

In contrast, people from the great middle and working classes should concern themselves with getting a real job, and stay out of cycling fandom—as should the deluded creatures who would like to become professionals rather than hobbyists. Because getting paid for silly things like taking pictures or writing? Terribly, terribly crass, don’t you think?

How quaintly 1920’s, stiff upper lip, public school, Chariots of Fire. Do you provide some of those fancy little tea sandwiches to set the right tone? And will those be free, too?

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

IMO

Another quick note…

I think some of the best work being done in women’s cycling today is done by Bart Hazen, Lyne Lamoureux, Davide Ronconi, although there are certainly a number of others I think are doing nice work like Carlo Ottolina, Giacomo Montrasio, Flaviano Ossola. There are several others I like as well.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 2, 2010 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

not bad

That’s pretty good work, but I have seen better this year to be honest, I really have. But the layout is horrible. You never, ever, put that many photos on a single webpage cause it will crash browsers. If he broke that into reasonable set of pages, he could also take the smaller photos and make them full size, or actually what he should have done is thumbnail them on several pages or posted them to a slideshow. That page is way, way too long!

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

After you raved 3 times about that BC shoot I finally checked it out

I thought there was maybe one compelling shot in the whole bunch:

Ceci n'est pas une signature.

by tedvdw on Sep 1, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

And you are an imposter...

I know who you are too, you have never been a fan of women’s cycling, but have been dragging it through the mud for years. However, I am glad you got a new life on Podium Cafe.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

ahem

We don’t do insults here. Attacking other users is not allowed. Thanks.

by Jen See on Sep 1, 2010 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know...

I know that and I would never do it, but I know this guy, and I held back the last time he harpooned me here, plus he broke the rules of netiquette by trying to ID me. He started it, but I will regress.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well

As it happens, we know him here too. And he contributes a great deal to the community. But either way, personal attacks aren’t permitted.

by Jen See on Sep 1, 2010 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok

ok, I apologize, and this is a nice comments/forum for women’s cycling. I am surprised Skip Madness has not found this slice. He would like it very much I think. I have seen very few like him who had so much knowledge to share about women’s cycling. I don’t have the time always, but this comments/forum seems to be one of the better ones for women’s cycling.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 1, 2010 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

And as I explained to you in that thread, what he did was well within the rules HERE.

The net is not one big sandbox with the same rules everywhere. Here, a striking percentage of the people identify themselves, and even meet up in the real world. We treat people as if we expect to meet them in person, hang out, buy them a beer, lend them a bike. If you are not happy with that sort of personal contact and exposure, this site (and its traditions) may not be someplace you’ll find congenial.

tedvdw has some 13,000 posts here. Many of them introducing people to women’s cycling. If that qualifies him as a non-fan in your head, I’m not quite sure I want to know what is required for you to acknowledge someone as a fan. And, no, that’s not a request for more information, to be quite clear.

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 1:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

clueless

You have no idea what’s you are talking about, but babble on. Like I said, I am glad he turned over a new leaf.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 1:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

OK, I may be, in part, "responding to tone"...

but you are posting on the borderline between “Ad hominem” and “name calling.” And we don’t do that here. (well, page up one post for the crashdan / PdC asshat-argument-pyramid™ )

And you don’t get a vote on how much time people should spend posting here, either. Not because you’re you, but because no-one gets a vote on other people’s lives.

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 2:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

double standard

Ah, Gavia just called me “Basta”. I think I know what he’s saying. I didn’t take that seriously though. 13,000 posts doesn’t sound like hijacking, that sounds like total domination. If he’s a God here, so be it, but he’s no God to me, and not very favorable to women’s cycling, to say the least, IMO. Look, I believe you’re breaking the rules in his favor. He did some tracking and then posted links to verify saying said Hello Jane B., and I could of said Hello _ _, and half a dozen other handles he used in the past but I didn’t.

My point is he’s allowed to traipse around and dig up stuff and try to finger people which is breaking the rules of netiquette because I guess he got God like status here. Please don’t try to debate that with me cause I been in computers ever since the days of the BBS and the first IBM 8088. I refrained from fingering him that time like he tried to do to me, I let it go.

However he thinks that was cute about posting that photo as the only one that was any good in that album, then you guys can have at it, but he’s never been a fan of women’s cycling that I can remember, quite the opposite. Besides, posting that photo as an end all to be all is hijacking to a certain extent, you don’t see me doing it, do you?

He does it all the time and nobody complains about that. So he’s got special God like status, but not with me. If he crosses me, I’ll call him on it. You know as well as me, he’s no expert at saying what photos are best in that album and which aren’t. I have looked at that album many times, and there are many, many compelling photos in it.

His post was incredulous, and requires some rebuffing. If he was a true fan of women’s cycling he would rightfully acknowledge that was a compelling album and I have heard from many who work in the field as pros who have told me they agreed that the British album was first rate work, and shots breath taking to say the least based on how the race was shot and the quality of the posted album. If you disagree fine, but I won’t go down the odious road with you. I’m not a teenager who engages in cyber babble. If Mr. 13,000 posts wants to leave me alone, then I will return the favor, but I have been working in women’s cycling far to long to tolerate nonsense when I see it. I offer my opinions and I don’t demand everyone agrees, but incredulous posts should be called or pointed out. That’s what forums are about. I’m not always right, but I can smell a rat when I see one.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Basta means enough in Italian.

Nothing more. I had hoped to prevent the other thread from becoming an infinite looping discussion as this one increasingly appears to be doing.

Also, for the record, my correct pronoun is “she”

by Jen See on Sep 3, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wait..you aren't a God???

/takes down shrine of Gavia which I have in my room because I have no life which my 15,000 comments clearly shows.

"Until you shoot me off my bike I'll keep looking for a contract" - Jens!
Quitter's People United member # 42

by Phil H. on Sep 3, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

ah..

13,000 posts? I can’t believe anyone has that much time on their hands. Forums should not take that much time out of your life, not something to aspire to.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 1:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

correction--

15,000+ “comments” not “posts.”
98 posts.

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sigh

13,000 not 15,000
and now it’s clearly past my bedtime.

by JFS_PGH on Sep 3, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

98

ok, 98.

13 or 15k, that’s insane, but it’s a misquote.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 3:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

and, so that's all. Nothing more really.

I don’t frequent men’s comments sections about racing related to men. I know that’s Mr. 98’s thing, and I respect that and wouldn’t try to talk about things I know nothing about, but by the same token I don’t respect men or anyone for that matter who traipse into the women’s section who have not been working in the women’s cycling field or for their causes for many years as I have and are automatically expected to respect their nonsense, especially since they don’t what they are talking about. I’m not into fluff talk.

Add to that I have seen men sabotage good women’s cycling threads more times then you can possibly imagine. I’ve been watching the beat down on women’s cycling in Internet forums for over a decade now, and it’s shameful and pathetic to say the least. There are lots of men who like to cut in and trash women’s cycling threads, it happens all the time. While they are not all trash talkers, the ones most dangerous are the intellectuals who cleverly apply their prowess to degrade the women’s side of the sport. The beat down on women’s cycling is all over the Internet, and I call a spade a spade when I see it. I am battle hardened over this nonsense.

by Sarah Bishop on Sep 3, 2010 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

What a great piece Pigeons... and what great female cyclists we have :)

"How strange it was to see men doing something beautiful. Something pointless and elegant." Tim Winton, 'Breath'

by Seahorse on Sep 1, 2010 5:23 AM EDT reply actions  

Thanks for your kind words!

It’s scary writing about the Aussies, because of all of you who know the riders in real life (very, very well, I suspect, in at least 2 cases!) – glad you like!

And so sorry for forgetting Alexis – thanks for the info

by Sarah Connolly on Sep 1, 2010 10:00 AM EDT reply actions  

ps I'm tormented by "Advance Australia Fair" going round & round in my head, ever since I started this one

which is problematic, as I can’t remember the actual words. I’m sure it doesn’t really go “Austra-li-a, Aus-traa-lia, advance Australia fair” repeated over & over & over!

by Sarah Connolly on Sep 1, 2010 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

You really are doing an awesome job here...so much work involved!

Chapeau! And it’s very educational ;)

Gora Euskaltel! Sorte on azenarioak!

by Albertina on Sep 1, 2010 6:24 PM EDT reply actions  

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