What? No bike race?
by Jen See on Jul 25, 2011 12:01 PM EDT
in Cafe Happy Hour!
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Honestly, I'm not quite sure what we will do. Well, until the next bike race. It looks like we have a couple fun post-Tour features in the works. You know how this loopy place works, we never really know what's going to happen until it does.
In the meantime, how about some favorite moments from the race? Me, I liked the part where Eddy Merckx popped out of the sunroof to cheer on Andy Schleck. How about that move, anyway? Gutsy, going from so far out like that. I also liked Pierre Rolland winning on the Alpe d'Huez. I thought for sure Alberto Contador was going to win that stage, not that there's anything wrong with that. But when Rolland attacked in the kilometers and the gap held? Ooh là là, that was an amazing moment. Your favorites?
Oh, and it seems that the interwebs are buzzing with rumors that Highroad has found a new sponsor and an announcement is imminent. I hope it's true. Can I use the fingers-crossed hashtag here?
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I was all set to do some work, then my databases went down for almost the whole day!
Why, for crying out loud, did that not happen last week?!
"First you have to be cool, after you are cool then you can be strong" -- Davide Appollonio
IT must be a bunch of cycling fans (I am - IT and cycling fan)...
We can literally script it so the work happens this way…
by JustJoshinYa on Jul 25, 2011 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah post racum depression.
and 11 hours in the truck. I guess I’ll file first…
Anyone who has every thought a working Photojournalist has a glam job needs to rethink...
by Christopher See on Jul 25, 2011 11:12 AM EDT reply actions
I liked the fact that Cadel needed to gain 57 seconds in Grenoble
He gained 59 seconds.
…
on Alberto Contador.
Obviously we all know what a beatdown he delivered to the doorstep of Andy Schleck.
"You better have a schleckond helping (of crow). You earned it."
--Paisley
by dees ees en drama on Jul 25, 2011 11:15 AM EDT reply actions
My favorite time gap was stages 16 & 17
when Andy’s lead over Contador was 39 seconds.
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
oooh, nice catch
I missed that one.
I was too freaked on the fact that Voeckler was higher in the standings than Contador. And, that Cunego was placed higher than Basso.
In chronological order, my fave parts
PhilGil winning Stage 1 and animating others until the high mountains.
The last few km of Stage 4.
Thor keeping yellow on Stage 8.
SamSan’s win on Luz-Ardiden.
Conta’s gains on stage 16 wet descent.
STAGE 18! Andy, Cadel, Voeckler.
by Chester Copperpot on Jul 25, 2011 11:16 AM EDT reply actions
Garmin
The TTT ripped that monkey off their backs, Tyler gave him a good kicking, and then Thor SMASH! him into the ground—twice. And then the team bus rolled over the remains on the way to delivering the boys to the podium for the team competition.
The power of argyle, baby!
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
by majope on Jul 25, 2011 11:31 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
and, let's not forget c-v-v's old geezer jersey award
"Wizard's first rule. People are stupid. They will believe anything they want to be true or fear to be true." -- Terry Goodkind
by umwolverine on Jul 25, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah that's phenomenal
I'm feverished, or the way you want to spell it
by plinytheelder on Jul 25, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
great tour for garmin
and on top of that, bubble boy gets a top 10. who woulda thunk it?
"Ants don’t worry, they operate like a fantastic team, they accept obstacles and deal with them in a positive manner, they don’t complain and remain positive. An ant doesn’t work on emotion, is proactive and always chooses the ant role."
Garmin definitely wins the award for team that looks like they had the most fun racing their bikes
1. Opening presentation with Thor in a wig and hammer and everyone else on bended knee
2. Closing ceremonies with a cardboard cutout of Dave Z for the teams presentation
3. They actually made a grey jersey with a viagra sponsorship for the GC race for the old guys on their team
I picked Riccardo Ricco for my 2011 VDS team, and submitted said team well before the submission deadline. I fully understand the error of my ways, and plead with the VDS Gods to allow me to resubmit my team.
by PopUp Rolen on Jul 25, 2011 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Indeed
How does anyone ever decide to leave that team? OK, more money, or they lose their spot. But all else being equal, does anyone say “I’d like to ride in a more dour atmosphere”?
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Wigan Athletic, baby
I'm feverished, or the way you want to spell it
by plinytheelder on Jul 25, 2011 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
That's how they stay in the premier league
Sminer: I blame KARMA for everything.
Jens: I've heard it's a bitch
Water Girl: I heard it ran over your dogma
Very well put
"You better have a schleckond helping (of crow). You earned it."
--Paisley
by dees ees en drama on Jul 25, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
8 years ago, they were a junior development squad (5280)...
by JustJoshinYa on Jul 25, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
5280 is 3269 years from now
not 8 years ago.
"Ants don’t worry, they operate like a fantastic team, they accept obstacles and deal with them in a positive manner, they don’t complain and remain positive. An ant doesn’t work on emotion, is proactive and always chooses the ant role."
I was told...aw, fuck it.
I’m going back to bed. Somebody wake me up if we get live pictures from Poland this year.
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
Where to start?
This race started with a bang and continued.
Could have down without the crashes.
The BMC group hug on the Champs
Cadel kissing the Lion on the podium
Yeah, the Eddie Merckx moment was fantastic.
Fav moments:
1. Maybe when Contador attacked at the very beginning of Télégraphe in stage 19. Because then I think we all knew that this was going to be a fantastic stage (often we all sweat mountain stages wondering when the action will start).
2. Anytime Roy/Hoogie/Gilbert attacked
3. The entire stage 18 – beautiful
moo
Stage 19, and 18, and probably 16 and some of stage 17.....and lot of the early stages
Kind of backups the much debated theme that its not the course that makes for an epic race, its the riders by deciding to race the course.
Stage 18/19 could both have been very disappointing but they had the balls to race, awesome.
and the epic profile and back drop really tied the race together
The end of Stage 20 for me. It was the first time I'd breathed without hyperventilating since Stage 16.
"How strange it was to see men doing something beautiful. Something pointless and elegant." Tim Winton, 'Breath'
:)
So how big is this at home? Is everyone talking about it? Was the country awake in the middle of the night watching? I know it’s a big place but I’d love to hear people’s stories from their corner of Oz.
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Well the tv ratings peaked at 2.4million viewers.
Bear in mind that’s about an 11% share at 1.30am. Roughly equivalent to an audience of 36million viewers in the US.
Every mainstream media outlet is still talking about it, with several commenters outside of the sport acknowledging that this might be the biggest achievement in Australian sport ever.
I know cricket talk is generally banned, but Don Bradman is our holiest sportsman. He played in the 30s and still holds the best batting average record. He’d be like combining every great baseball player into one sportsperson here. So when mainstream articles even ask the question “Is Cadel winning the Tour more important than Bradman’s triple century against the British during the Ashes?” you can tell it’s a big deal.
Actually if people are genuinely curious, I might cobble together a fanpost with links to local media and stuff.
I suck at VDS but at least I chose the right bottle of wine for this stage.
by omnevelnihil on Jul 26, 2011 4:11 AM EDT up reply actions
It's been huge
On all the radio stations, lead item on TV news, front pages of newspapers (and multi-page spreads inside them too).
Cycling normally is a pretty low profile sport here in comparison to the various forms of football.
Been compared to Australia winning the America’s cup yachting back in 1983, which was also a huge achievement, and one that many people here would remember as a massive event.
Fanpost would be cool
Oz media rarely holds back in anything, especially over glorifying the achievements of Australians. Same goes for media all round the world, but the Aussies seem to do it better!
Comparison to Bradman is maybe a bit far ?
I mean his achievements are pretty much double what anyone else has ever achieved in the sport either before and since, and we are talking about a sport with records back to 1864 – that’s pretty awesome. Guess if the comparisons is only against one match, then fair enough and you can put me down as a vote for the Tour win being more important.
Anywho, yes to a fan post if you have time
This is big
(Which surprises me, given the amount of sh!t you cop on the roads from some passing cars.)
Maybe it’s because people know I’m into this stuff, but I have had many conversations about cycling with people who I thought couldn’t care less about it all.
Everyone loves a winner, I suppose. This will have an impact here, I am sure.
I was in a cafe reading the SMH and a woman at the table next to me pointed at the photo of Cadel
and commented that although she’d never watched cycling she thought this was an amazing feat. There ensued a pleasant 15 minutes chatting about Cuddles and his accomplishments.
On the other hand, the whole debate in Oz as sportsmen being touted as heroes is raging again. I frankly think anyone finishing the Tour de France is heroic, and Cadel more than most but I’ve been following the arguments with interest.
"How strange it was to see men doing something beautiful. Something pointless and elegant." Tim Winton, 'Breath'
It's bloody huge
The culture here is such that at the first hint of Aussie sporting success, the entire nation is behind them. Heh, to quote a mate of mine – “I didn’t watch it, bloody pushbikes [muttermutter]… BUT I WAS BARRACKING FOR THE AUSSIE!”, LOL
After the TT, I was bombarded with text messages from friends and workmates about it – none of whom are ‘into’ cycling. And bear in mind that this was at 2am here… I was pleasantly surprised about that :-).
My favorite moment of the Tour?
Stage 5 Gilbert flying to the finish line, HTC train just got derailed, along with my heart. I am closing my eyes, opening them again, trying to remind myself to not forget to breath! And suddenly, as from thin air, magically appears Mr. Cavendish and rips his first victory of this Tour! I jumped so high, my office ceiling forever will has a mark in the memory of this day!
"I love bike races warm up, warm down, cobbles mountains or flats."
perezbike
.
Cav pulled out of tonights Post Tour crit in Aalst
apparently because of important sponsor commitments. Gee I wonder who he might need to speak to?
They certainly need to look in that direction.
It would be fantastic if they can land a solid german sponsor.
That's the rumor, at the moment, right?
They’ve certainly got money and sponsor other sporting events. Here’s hoping.
they even make phones
he can demonstrate his victory salute for them
and his crotch pointing salute
could be him pointing to his own siemens factory.
"Ants don’t worry, they operate like a fantastic team, they accept obstacles and deal with them in a positive manner, they don’t complain and remain positive. An ant doesn’t work on emotion, is proactive and always chooses the ant role."
by ant1 on Jul 26, 2011 9:16 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
hahaha!!!
I'm feverished, or the way you want to spell it
by plinytheelder on Jul 26, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
No longer
Sold to BenQ in 2005 which went bust the next year.
"On paper, your team is awesome." -- Pigeons on my WVDS team, and life in general.
not mobile phones
but still cordless, VOIP phones
Cav and Renshaw to VacansOleil! I know I know guys, Don’t throw stuff at me, put the Bahhamer back on the shelf!
Can I dream of the Paradise on Earth just for a second?
"I love bike races warm up, warm down, cobbles mountains or flats."
perezbike
.
Only for a second.
"How strange it was to see men doing something beautiful. Something pointless and elegant." Tim Winton, 'Breath'
I would think that going for a win on the Champs 4 years in a row
Would be enough to keep Cavendish there.
Too bad
I hear he won it.
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
They got SamSan as a replacement
Oddly, in a post-tour crit the KOM has as good a chance to win a sprint as the worlds greatest sprinter.
Not if he's there with the world's greatest sprinter though
I think green trumps KoM.
I’m playing with the idea of going to the Lommel crit (Vanendert, PhilGil, Summie for now). Not sure if it’ll be worth it.
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Yeah, while on his way to the bakery
Such a Belgian, that Summie. Nothing too serious, some bumps, scrapes, sore shoulder and a headache.
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Aargh! Why wasn't he there last year when I was there?!
"First you have to be cool, after you are cool then you can be strong" -- Davide Appollonio
In other news, the Dutchies don't get how crits work
Lars Boom beat Hoogie and Ten Dam. Boom DNFs and he beats the two broken heroes of Holland? Bad Dutchie!
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
OK, SamSan still looks retarted in that dots outfit
But man, that is some victory award they got!
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Want. That. Beer.
Just got in from a half hour run, which wouldn’t be that bad if it weren’t 92 degrees.
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
Texas, right?
I read this today and was shocked to see that:
- Fort Smith, Arkansas has set a new record for the greatest number of consecutive 100 F days, with 20 through July 24.
- As of Sunday, the 23 days in a row with 100 F heat or greater in Dallas/Ft. Worth stood at number five on that city’s all-time list of 100-degree streaks.
- San Angelo, Texas has already had 58 100-degree days, which is ranked number 3 of all-time.
- Abilene has had 44 days this year with highs of 100 F or greater, and as of yesterday only needed two more such days to tie its all-time record, set in 1934.
- Amarillo, Texas, has set a new record for the greatest number of 100-degree days in a calendar year, with 28 such days through July 23rd.
- In Wichita, KS the average high temperature so far this summer is 101.2 F, which ranks 3rd on the list of all-time warmest summers.
But the biggest thing in that post was that “4,376 record highest minimum temperature records were broken or tied through July 23”…meaning, it’s not just the heat, but the fact that it hasn’t cooled down in the evenings either…
Oh, well, I got seriously off topic there…I blame the heat (which broke here in the northeast – was mid-70s today)…
by JustJoshinYa on Jul 25, 2011 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
44 days this year with highs of 100 F or greater
Just shoot me. Actually, I wouldn’t say that in Texas.
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Brings back memories of February
… trying to sleep in a room where the temp was at around 95 at midnight – without aircon… or, indeed, electricity, for that matter. For several days running. Fun times :-).
Man, they chug those things right on the podium?
I’ve probably got 5kg on Sammy and if I slammed a beer that big after a “race” I’d be drunk for about a week!
+1
Actually make it 2. I’ll definitely be wanting a chaser.
I suck at VDS but at least I chose the right bottle of wine for this stage.
by omnevelnihil on Jul 26, 2011 4:15 AM EDT up reply actions
sigh It's too late to become a crit winning profesional cyclist isn't it
No comments will be made on my complete lack of athletic ability
by randomgerbil on Jul 25, 2011 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Might be cheaper
to fly to Belgium and stop in a pub.
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions
So awesome! I love Belgium!
And I love those dots, though he could have got some red gloves.
"First you have to be cool, after you are cool then you can be strong" -- Davide Appollonio
What wasn't there to love about this year's Tour?
Honestly, unlike a normal Tour de France, there were few days that seemed to bore the heck out of me.
I loved Gilbert’s win. Sammy on Luz Ardiden. Sammy and Bert on the descent into Pinarolo. And Sammy and Bert again on Alpe D’Huez.
I also loved the time trial but in part because I’m a Narcissist.
You can read my article here where not only did I predict Cadel would win (easy predcition) but that Andy’s finishing time would be 58’09" (57’51" + 18 sec.) based on the 43’33" TT he did in the Tour de Suisse.
… his actual finishing time? 58’11" (2 seconds off. not bad eh?)
I don’t think anyone could have predicted Evans would crush the course as convincingly as he did, even if you believed he would win.
What wasn’t there to love about this year’s Tour?
The crashes. Man, we lost a lot of guys.
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Yeah, I can reluctantly agree to that I guess
I also thought someone was going to say that.
However, I obviously don’t love the crashes (because it’s horrible to see the guys get injured) but they always happen and that inpredictability (since I’m talking predictions) and immediate drama that follows, adds another level to the race.
And not in a “Nascar – I only am excited when there are crashes kinda way”. But then, Nascar is hardly anything more than ridiculous cars going pointlessly around in circles for hours one will never getting back.
But there were so many of them
in so little time. For that first week or so, they were dropping like flies. It also didn’t help that so many victims were guys I liked :)
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Empathyface
#benat
"First you have to be cool, after you are cool then you can be strong" -- Davide Appollonio
Him too. It sucked. I was so upset that first week.
What sport can do to one! I guess with Benat I made the mistake of imagining the fairytale…him doing something amazing in memory of Tondo. Breaking your arm in the first stage, seriously bah.
"First you have to be cool, after you are cool then you can be strong" -- Davide Appollonio
This is horribly insensitive of me, but I'm gonna type it anyway
NASCAR does less and less for me because for the most part the crashes are so inconsequential. Sure, crashes cost the teams a race and butt-loads of money, but there’s something sort of admittedly wonderful about the notion that a human can wipe out spectacularly at a 300kph and just walk away from it.
Cycling, on the other hand . . .
You did also post this here though on the same day:
stage-19-rolland-takes-biggest-victory-of-his-career#72470950
which said Andy could equal Evans time. And you said that Vino beat Evans in the Dauphinee TT in the article which he didn’t, but that’s being pedantic.
Yeah, those were my random thoughts before I re-calculated.
I did a bit more number crunching and realized I was off.
but…. those comments and that conversation were the genesis of my more accurate post and calculation.
The Vino thing, that’s not being Pedantic, that’s being a good editor for me. Thx. Fixed.
I'll never forget
driving back into cellphone range Saturday afternoon and finding out Cadel won. Yep, that was a memory.
If cobble delusions are wrong, who wants to be right? -JFS PGH
by Chris Fontecchio on Jul 25, 2011 1:58 PM EDT reply actions
i spent the last week without electricity or phone coverage
spent last night catching-up on recorded highlights without knowing the outcome – watching the last week of the tour condensed into 6 hours was intense to say the least.
by thebongolian on Jul 25, 2011 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions
if I could netflix a tour...wow
not sure my heart would take it…
by JustJoshinYa on Jul 25, 2011 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Pick Giro climbs day 6
now that the anomaly of a good TdF route has passed we can get back to the race that truly matters.
http://www.facebook.com/giroditalia
Lawrence S Predicted Cadel’s amazing ITT, almost up to the seconds!
And I predicted this comment from Phil, almost up to exact wording!
"I love bike races warm up, warm down, cobbles mountains or flats."
perezbike
.
Hoogerland on the podium collecting his Mts jersey in tears...
He was always a favorite of mine, but staying in the race and continuing to attack, no less…I have no words…
I can’t wait for my Welcome to Hoogerland tshirt to show up. He’s class!
I believe I got a cute little picture of him after the ITT
Let’s see if this picture shows up properly…
Frustration has a way of releasing itself, rarely in a logical manner. -jsallee00
A full smile! Very rare.
"On paper, your team is awesome." -- Pigeons on my WVDS team, and life in general.
It seemed that most every day had a moment of wonderfulness.
I LOVED Thor’s masterful descent for his first stage victory.
I loved that EBH won the day after the sadness of losing to Thor (his 2nd stage victory).
That HTC train is a powerful force of nature. I love Cav, adore the train and worry about the future if he changes teams.
Stage 18 and stage 19. I appreciated seeing Andy break out, I admired AC’s never-say-die attack and Andy’s ability to stay with him for a long time even after the day before’s exertion.
And fave post-race moment: learning that Cadel has a framed pic of TinTin on a bike. That’s gotta make me love the guy.
He collects all kinds of TinTin stuff
The evil bastards at Lotto got him a first edition of ’L’Oreille Cassee’ (the broken ear) after his World Champ title.
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
That's fantastic.
Those books, in English translation, were an integral part of my kids’ journey to learning to read. And my husband and I never regretted all those hours spent reading and rereading them. In the pic you posted, Cadel’s hair is definitely TinTin-esque, too! (Although I guess some of that is the S in Silence but I’m going to pretend I didn’t notice that.)
by KnittingGene on Jul 25, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
And finally, a movie is coming out. My oldest just saw the preview... stoked.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Really?
I didn’t know. Anyone good associated with it? I’ll have to IMDB it (when I’m not at, um, work.)
by KnittingGene on Jul 25, 2011 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Director: Steven Spielberg
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0983193/
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
Much better--Screenplay: Steven Moffatt
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
Had to google
“co-created Sherlock” is a pretty good sign in my book. Loved those, can’t wait for series 2.
Yep (sadly)
but still worth flagging up. :)
New ones commissioned, due later this year – mid-late autumn apparently
FYI: PdC is terrible for work productivity, even when there isn't a race!
Hmm, well, I’m interested but I tend to be a bit skeptical about favorite books turned into movies.
by KnittingGene on Jul 25, 2011 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I refuse to go see movie adaptations of books I really love
The screen can never live up to your imagination
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
One notable exception: The Princess Bride.
It does help when the author also writes the screenplay—and CAN write a screenplay.
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
To Kill A Mockingbird was very well done.
"Wizard's first rule. People are stupid. They will believe anything they want to be true or fear to be true." -- Terry Goodkind
Agreed
I think the film is better than the book, for sure.
Don't know if I'd go that far--it's also a terrific book.
You don't quit the Tour because of a thick lip--Laurens ten Dam
Yup, the movies can often disappoint.
And since a good part of the wonder that is TinTin are the visuals, I am not that hopeful about a live action movie. BUT, that said, it would be lots of fun if it turned out to be good. We’ll see….
by KnittingGene on Jul 25, 2011 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
They're using the same technique as used in "The Polar Express"
Would allow for no restrictions in telling the story the way they want to. I’m very optimistic.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
It looks to have been improved upon...
or the look and feel is a lot more realistic than “The Polar Express”.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Just generally it was great to see the two Norwegians succeed after the attacks in Oslo
I know when 9/11 happened, I turned to sports for some escape.
1.Cadel’s stage win
2.Andy’s monstrous and well-planned attack
3.Contador cracking on Galibier
4.Rolland besting Contador and SamSan on Alpe d’Huez
5.and my favorite photo, I call it Cadel’s wake
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Which I still don't understand
It would have made sense if Andy had blown up trying to follow Cadel, but Frank? When did he put in one volt of work during the entire Tour?
Cuz…, it’s not like hard or anything to ride to a podium finish at the Tour de France.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
shhh... that's a secret
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Sitting on wheels is a ton easier than not sitting on wheels
It’s all relative. Or……is that your whole point, that Frank was just weak?
No, they're mocking you
Cause you seem to think that finishing third in the Tour is a cakewalk and Fränk isn’t allowed to be tired
I am ready to hug the world - Tony Martin.
by tgsgirl on Jul 26, 2011 3:16 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't see why it's unreasonable to think that he should be less likely to pop than other riders
He was never on the front. Not once. Everyone else was, a time or two.
Mind you, I'm not saying he _should_ have been on the front at any time
The way he rode made fine tactical sense.
it's not that big a difference on climbs
mostly people sit on wheels on climbs because they don’t want to be behind and they don’t have the legs to attack – and anyway, unless the attack is really good, the others are just going to follow anyway. But the advantage they get from drafting aint much.
Sitting on wheels easier when climbing? No.
It’s much easier when you let that wheel go and ride your own hard tempo. You will lose the race by seconds or minutes, but as Cadel demonstrated for 10k on the Galibier, sitting on wheels ain’t easier.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Yes it is
They’re going somewhere between 18 and 28 km/h up high alpine climbs. Drafting is definitely advantageous at anything but the steepest stretches. Besides, the climbing abilities of the first group of riders are actually very close; they are all world class. So a small advantage does make a difference. Regarding the mental side, for getting up the mountain as fast as possible, I must say I find it much easier to hang on in a wheel that is 1 km/h faster than what I find comfortable, than to try & force that uncomfortable tempo on my own.
"On paper, your team is awesome." -- Pigeons on my WVDS team, and life in general.
Yeah I agree with this
There’s the mental aspect, but at those speeds there’s certainly also a drafting advantage (physics)
i saw once where
someone had calculated armstrong’s average speed on all the climbs of one tour and it came out to 19kph (this doesn’t fit very well with your 18 to 28, which is possible more accurate) – there’s a little help in terms of drafting but i don’t think it’s that large – now on the parts where they’re going close to 30, sure. I’d say 18 to low 20’s the advantage of drafting is still pretty small. Of course every little bit helps, but …. Anyway i say it’s time for SuperTed to come to the rescue and come up with some numbers – how much of the work on a climb at a certain speed is put in to overcoming wind resistance. We’d have to come up with a speed and a gradient.
Use the form at
http://www.analyticcycling.com/ForcesPower_Page.html
Vary slope around 0.08 (=8%) and speed around 5.6 m/s (=20 km/h) and see what rolls out for the power number, wind resistance and rolling resistance. I’d say the wind resistance (and thus drafting) is no longer significant when it drops below the rolling resistance. Power should be around 400 W for the best climbers. (Danny Pate mentioned having averaged 380 W for a couple of hours on the front on “flat” terrain. He is larger so probably has more watts but it was also a much longer effort.)
"On paper, your team is awesome." -- Pigeons on my WVDS team, and life in general.
ok,
so i played around with that a little and it definitely supports your idea that wind resistance is still very important at these low speeds. But from personal experience if i compare riding solo at 20kph on a flat with riding 20kph on an 8% grade there is an enormous difference in the effort required. On the other hand if i compare riding in a group on a flat road at 20kph vs riding solo there is very little difference. I have no experience riding up 8% climbs at a sustained 20kph, solo or in groups, so i can’t say anything about that.
Sure,
it depends a lot on how you define significant. Perhaps the rolling resistance threshold is too low, I’m not quite sure. Another way of looking at it is: how much of the total power output goes into overcoming wind drag? The numbers on that page suggest it’s about 4.5 N * 5.5 m/s ~= 25 W which is about 6% of the total power output of around 400 W. That sounds quite significant but the question is how much difference drafting makes. Problem is I couldn’t find models for that.
At a slope of 8.5% and speed of 20 km/h, the standard rider from Analytic Cycling puts out 390 W. To get to 21 km/h, he needs 410 W. While that 20 W difference is less than the full wind drag of 25 W, I am not sure it is comparable to any drafting benefit.
So what I’m saying is, you might be right after all :) Bunching up on steep climbs seems mostly mental, even for the pros … On the other hand, like I said, physical differences among the contenduhs are very small. To get an idea: going up the Alpe d’Huez at 21 km/h versus 20 km/h makes a difference of TWO whole minutes (given it’s 14 km long). So even a drafting benefit of less than 1 km/h is probably significant.
"On paper, your team is awesome." -- Pigeons on my WVDS team, and life in general.
so it' probably small
but a small amount can make an important difference. Also when you are riding so close to your thresholds on those climbs i can imagine that any little bit of help can be the difference between hanging on falling back.
Don't mean to deny the sligtht aero advantage depending of course on the gradient.
Was just answering to the comment that it’s “tons easier” to sit on wheels when climbing as opposed to riding your own tempo. Holding onto wheels is much more a mental game than an aero advantage game though (you know me, no science to back that statement up).
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Now if there's a headwind while climbing, ugh.
Hide behind anything and anyone.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
not a counter to your points
and really it has nothing to do with the advantages of drafting on steep slopes, but one advantage of following wheels is that when the road does flatten out, you are in a position to draft. in climbs where there are steep sections intermixed with flatter ones, following wheels allows you to take advantage of the draft when the opportunity arises.
btw, did you see the picture of the ti spork in my ride post?
"Ants don’t worry, they operate like a fantastic team, they accept obstacles and deal with them in a positive manner, they don’t complain and remain positive. An ant doesn’t work on emotion, is proactive and always chooses the ant role."
Yes, the group is always stronger.
Imagine if anyone contributed to Cadel’s efforts on the final 10k of the Galibier.
Going to check out the spork.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
Favourites (not already brought up above)
All things Norway
EBH coming of age – 2 wins, and a miss, plus 2nd on the champs. He’s some rider.
Thor – in the TTT, the next days sprint, keeping yellow on the Mur d B, and turning into a formidable barodeur. Great tour sir.
The fantastic roadside support for their riders – year on year.
I think my fave thing about this year's Tour
is that Michael Smith ESPN dude hasn’t had a new tweet for almost 2 weeks.
I'm feverished, or the way you want to spell it
Why no media on Voeckler?
He writing a book? I would love to read any article about him doing well. Making a mistake. Anything!
A slew of thoughts
I enjoyed the early stages with uphill finishes (gilbert and evans winning), tyler’s win on july 4 (USA!), garmin TTT (finally a stage win for the scrappy boulder boys), and thor’s huge win in lourdes. A sprinter winning a mountain stage? That’s why they race the stages. Clearly garmin’s good fortune’s made for an exciting experience. Since they started in 2008, I have been waiting for the breakthrough. Merging with cervelo stacked the deck, but so what. Also, they have the lithuanian national road champion, so seeing the flag of my mother’s home country driving the front of the peloton was awesome.
I am happy for Cadel. He was strongest, rode hardest, and played his cards the right way—and he prepared for fully than any rider this year. Andy is a good, soon-to-be great rider. His time will come. Alberto, pending arbitration, will be a force if he returns fresh. This year’s Giro was brutal, and he paid for it. He had to race in Italy, because he was not guaranteed the tour due to his case.
This edition was very human—men (boys, in the case of schleck, rolland, and hoogerland) rising above pain and fear to triumph. Voeckler, showing the world what it means to dream, yet fall short as soon as you believe in that dream. Contador, knowing his limit and riding past it. Evans, feeling pressure and seeing failure, but not letting it get the best of him this time.
It is a wonderful month. I am in a state of mild shock when it is over. The rhythm of the summer cut short. Fall is coming. Soon it will worlds and lombardy. Then the long winter until the classics, which are my favorite—but they are not the tour. This year, my hope that the sport is clean and progressing has grown anew. I cannot give up, not yet. Not with the future battles we will be so lucky to watch.
On Garmin's stacked deck
It didn’t amount to anything for these guys during the part of the year they were suppose to excel… the spring classics. I’ll say it again, JVS saved their assess from total embarrassment.
Then they come into the Tour and accomplish way more than they hoped for. Bizzaro
Great write up.
"It's a lovely thing, feeling that momentum. If you're lucky, it's also about grace." Tim Winton
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